Red clover

Location
Ceredigion
Only 3 cuts?



Why 6 weeks?

We cut with 1st cut 14th May
34 days later 2nd cut
46 days later 3rd cut and
37 days later 4th cut.
Heifers then went into it mid October.
That may be the casse but Red clover will not persist if continuously grazed or cut to frequently at 30 days . Recomendation is 6 to 8 weeks
 

Sid

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
South Molton
That may be the casse but Red clover will not persist if continuously grazed or cut to frequently at 30 days . Recomendation is 6 to 8 weeks
That's why ours doesn't last the 2-3 years as stated. Getting 5 or more years must be due to bad cutting management we do

that is because the beast grazes the crown off the plant and repeated cutting too low
hence lasts longer if cut at 3 inch stubble
Sheep are the main culprits of this.
 

neilo

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Montgomeryshire
And you open a can off worms . Some will say its only a mating that counts and others will argue its the ragwort effect . Builds up over time then hits you . But they all seem to agree the effect is worse in conserved forage . The good thing is it only effects breeding ewes , rams lambs and cattle unaffected
Really? I've just been leafing through the Cotswold Grass Seeds brochure that came the other day, and they say the exact opposite of that (which I was always led to believe).
 

Sid

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
South Molton
Really? I've just been leafing through the Cotswold Grass Seeds brochure that came the other day, and they say the exact opposite of that (which I was always led to believe).
From Aber

Red clover can contain phyto-oestrogens which can reduce ovulation rates in sheep. Providing breeding ewes are removed from grazing red clover 6 weeks before and 6 weeks after tupping then the risk of reduced fertility is negligible.

Only says can. Would imagine plant breeding maybe able to remove that issue?
 

Kevtherev

Member
Location
Welshpool Powys
From Aber

Red clover can contain phyto-oestrogens which can reduce ovulation rates in sheep. Providing breeding ewes are removed from grazing red clover 6 weeks before and 6 weeks after tupping then the risk of reduced fertility is negligible.

Only says can. Would imagine plant breeding maybe able to remove that issue?
Always led to believe that was correct advice.
 
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Location
Ceredigion
Really? I've just been leafing through the Cotswold Grass Seeds brochure that came the other day, and they say the exact opposite of that (which I was always led to believe).
I have done an alfull lot of reading on the subject , not for my own gain, i no longer keep sheep, but i sell seed so try and offer responsible advice , for every article that states just remove at mating i could show you another 4 that state that after effects can be cumulative over time, this would depend on the amount of clover in the sward but given the findings bellow I think it rather foolish to feed a pure stand of red clover silage to breeding sheep over the winter , but then its up to a sheep farmer to make his own mind up on the subject

I would aslso draw you attention to the study, :"6 weeks before and after lambing" , they did not study the long term effects if sheep had access to red clover over a longer period

To understand better the industry-wide approach to avoid grazing breeding ewes on red clover for the six weeks before and after tupping, industry bodies – EBLEX, HCC, QMS and AgriSearch – commissioned the Institute of Biological, Environmental and Rural Sciences (IBERS) at the University of Aberystwyth, to investigate further


EBLEX, HCC, QMS and AgriSearch – commissioned the Institute of Biological, Environmental and Rural Sciences (IBERS) at the University of Aberystwyth, to investigate further.

The IBERS study backed up the approach

Some of the The key findings


Ewe lambs being used for breeding should NOT be grazed on red clover pastures
Red clover silage and hay can have a higher phyto-oestrogen content than the sward, and the type of silage inoculant used can also impact on levels, with bacterial inoculants creating higher levels than formic acid based inoculants

• No negative effects have been recorded from grazing rearing or working rams on red clover
 
Location
Ceredigion
also Its nice to see Germinal have taken a responsible view on the subject
Helen Mathieu
Area Manager, Germinal GB

Re Farming Connect 23 Feb 021

But caution is needed when using it in sheep systems, she added; avoid grazing it with ewes six weeks either side of tupping, even when the red clover content in a mixed sward is low as it can seriously diminish fertility.

This is generally only short term but continuous grazing of red clover may have a longer term effect on fertility, not just in the short term but chronically, Ms Mathieu warned
 
Location
Ceredigion
Don’t know any sheep farmers that grow red clover for sheep and for silage intended for sheep.
Always led to believe that red clover was the dairymans choice for 3-4 cuts of high protein silage with grass to reduce the amount of bought in feeds.
Its a shame a sheep farmer opened the discussion about it then
But joking aside if you care to look back over the forum history the subject has been discussed many times . By sheep farmers
 
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Get ready for pest monitoring, advises PGRO

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Written by Charlotte Cunningham

The Processors and Growers Research Organisation (PGRO) has issued new advice to help growers understand the importance of measuring pest populations before any decisions are made on insecticides. Charlotte Cunningham reports. Ahead of the trapping season, the PGRO has produced a new masterclass video to help growers understand how to trap and assess pest populations. The key advice is that using a range of preventative tools will be crucial for farmers looking to reduce cases of pea and bean weevil, pea moth, and silver Y moth this spring, while finding more sustainable ways of farming in line with new agricultural policy, according to the PGRO’s research and...
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