Red Tractor and Halal

[Grass And Grain]

Maybe someone can enlighten me.

Am I correct in thinking that Red Tractor allows RT assured farms to sell their stock into non-stun slaughterhouses? (i.e. the RT standards don't specifically stop their members selling to these markets).

 

[Northeastfarmer]

You are correct

 

[Grass And Grain]

Thank you @Northeastfarmer

Seems unbelievable, when RT go on so much about their high animal welfare standards.

 

[Grass And Grain]

So I'm guessing that quite a lot of cull ewes and lambs from Red Tractor farms end up getting slaughtered this way. Maybe other species as well?

Edit. Presumably RT haven't explicitly banned it because it will cut off markets for their members. Hence if RT bring this in as a standard, they could lose farmer members.

So RT are stuck between a rock and a hard place?

 

[Northeastfarmer]

So I'm guessing that quite a lot of cull ewes and lambs from Red Tractor farms end up getting slaughtered this way. Maybe other species as well?

Edit. Presumably RT haven't explicitly banned it because it will cut off markets for their members. Hence if RT bring this in as a standard, they could lose farmer members.

So RT are stuck between a rock and a hard place?

A proportion will be killed via either kosher or non stun yes

 

[Tim W]

I had a look at the RT standards for abattoirs and animals that go through non stun abattoirs would lose their RT status
For livestock to retain their assurance status, they must be pre-stunned and then exsanguinated (bled) (RT standards Meat Processing AW0)

If that's the case then RT does not support non stun kill

 

[Grass And Grain]

So a lamb gets killed via a very humane method, gets a RT sticker and ends up on the shelf at Tesco, ASDA, Sainsbury's, Marks and Spencer, Morrisons etc.

But said lamb's brother or mum from the same RT assured farm might get slaughtered by having it's throat cut.

Seems immoral for RT to bang on about their high welfare standards, but knowingly allow this for stock from their RT assured farms.

What do people think. Should RT standards allow this?

 

[Tim W]

You are correct

A proportion will be killed via either kosher or non stun yes

Wrong ----see above

 

[Tim W]

So a lamb gets killed via a very humane method, gets a RT sticker and ends up on the shelf at Tesco, ASDA, Sainsbury's, Marks and Spencer, Morrisons etc.

But said lamb's brother or mum from the same RT assured farm might get slaughtered by having it's throat cut.

Seems immoral for RT to bang on about their high welfare standards, but knowingly allow this for stock from their RT assured farms.

What do people think. Should RT standards allow this?

There is a consultation on RT at the moment---let them know
But i would suggest it is out of their hands
The only way to ensure that an animal was going to be killed non stun would be for a farmer to sell directly to a non stun abattoir---not through a mart or a store buyer?

 

[Grass And Grain]

I had a look at the RT standards for abattoirs and animals that go through non stun abattoirs would lose their RT status
For livestock to retain their assurance status, they must be pre-stunned and then exsanguinated (bled) (RT standards Meat Processing AW0)

If that's the case then RT does not support non stun kill

Hi Tim,

That's right, the non-stun product isn't allowed to put a RT sticker on it, because the slaughterhouse isn't assured.

But the lamb that went through there may well probably have come from a RT assured farm.

@Clive read through this thread. What do you thinl to this? Apologies for tagging you into a livestock thread, you might not have ever been onto this section of tff before

 

[Northeastfarmer]

Wrong ----see above

I’m not wrong

 

[Grass And Grain]

Wrong ----see above

I think @Northeastfarmer is correct

 

[Tim W]

I think @Northeastfarmer is correct

As soon as the RT lamb goes into a non RT abattoir it is no longer able to be sold with a RT sticker ?

 

[Northeastfarmer]

As soon as the RT lamb goes into a non RT abattoir it is no longer able to be sold with a RT sticker ?

That wasn’t the question

 

[ollie989898]

I was under the impression that Halal slaughter permits pre-stunning. It is in fact kosher that does not stun?

 

[Northeastfarmer]

I was under the impression that Halal slaughter permits pre-stunning. It is in fact kosher that does not stun?

Correct

 

[Tim W]

That wasn’t the question

Sorry, i thought it was?
So do you think that if a farm is RT assured then all it's produce should only end up with an RT sticker?
Can an organic producer sell produce into the non organic market?
Can a Pasture Fed producer sell animals without the Pasture Fed logo?

 

[Northeastfarmer]

Sorry, i thought it was?
So do you think that if a farm is RT assured then all it's produce should only end up with an RT sticker?
Can an organic producer sell produce into the non organic market?
Can a Pasture Fed producer sell animals without the Pasture Fed logo?

The question was does RT allow you to sell to non stun abattoirs.
Unless I’ve missed something no one has told me I’m not allowed to

 

[Grass And Grain]

As soon as the RT lamb goes into a non RT abattoir it is no longer able to be sold with a RT sticker ?

True, but it doesn't get away from the fact that RT allows animals from its assured farms to go gor ritual slaughter.

I think it stinks of a cover up, it's conning the consumer that RT assured stock are welfare friendly, and personally I think the standards need changing. Everyone knows that many of the cull ewes will end up in these places, and they've come from RT assured farms.

Can't think of any reason that the standards shouldn't be updated. Unless of course RT are more bothered about their own income.

 

[Tim W]

True, but it doesn't get away from the fact that RT allows animals from its assured farms to go gor ritual slaughter.

I think it stinks of a cover up, it's conning the consumer that RT assured stock are welfare friendly, and personally I think the standards need changing. Everyone knows that many of the cull ewes will end up in these places, and they've come from RT assured farms.

Can't think of any reason that the standards shouldn't be updated. Unless of course RT are more bothered about their own income.

It's not conning anyone surely?
There are no RT products on sale in shops to consumers that have been non stun slaughtered
When I buy RT lamb/beef/pork i know it has been pre stun slaughtered to a set of standards