Second spring barley into barley volunteers

[ajd132]

Got second spring barley and spring wheat going into volunteer spring barley as soon as it dries up enough. I am planning to spray off ASAP as worried about effects
Of cereal after cereal. Is this the best way to proceed? I will also point out that my drill has liquid fert on it and I will be putting a big dose of the N under the seed at planting.

 

[lloyd]

Got second spring barley and spring wheat going into volunteer spring barley as soon as it dries up enough. I am planning to spray off ASAP as worried about effects
Of cereal after cereal. Is this the best way to proceed? I will also point out that my drill has liquid fert on it and I will be putting a big dose of the N under the seed at planting.

More glyphosphate use .
In other posts you advocate the reduction of chemicals
so isn't the time to think outside the box?

 

[Spud]

What's the rush? It's winter, nowt will grow for a month anyway, regardless of N applied.
Fair chance we'll get some frost to knock out s barley volunteers before March.
Patience is the way forward.

 

[ajd132]

More glyphosphate use .
In other posts you advocate the reduction of chemicals
so isn't the time to think outside the box?

One dose of glyphosate a year and that’s because we have blackgrass, I could roll on a frost to kill the barley but unfortunately grass weeds don’t die from that. I advocate reduction in prophylactic use of chemical with agronomic systems based upon what kills what (which is failing due to resistance and withdrawals). I’ve never said not use chemical, just get better at how we use them. So far we havnt used insecticides (including deter) for 3 years and have tailored back our fungicide usage and the amount of nitrogen we are using, I am trying.

 

[ajd132]

What's the rush? It's winter, nowt will grow for a month anyway, regardless of N applied.
Fair chance we'll get some frost to knock out s barley volunteers before March.
Patience is the way forward.

Worried about allelopathic effects of cereals going into a thick carpet of decaying cereals. We have learnt aslong as you don’t completely maul it in, the earlier drilled the better here (and at less risk of drought compared to April sown crops. Realistically want to be drilled up by March 20th

 

[lloyd]

Ok I've grazed foot deep barley volunteers with store sheep.
Now looks like fresh cut stubble .
More sheep going on volunteers this week,cheap
way of feeding sheep.
Looks like you will need to introduce livestock .

 

[Spud]

Worried about allelopathic effects of cereals going into a thick carpet of decaying cereals. We have learnt aslong as you don’t completely maul it in, the earlier drilled the better here (and at less risk of drought compared to April sown crops. Realistically want to be drilled up by March 20th

What's the current field state, stubble or worked ground?

 

[ajd132]

Ok I've grazed foot deep barley volunteers with store sheep.
Now looks like fresh cut stubble .
More sheep going on volunteers this week,cheap
way of feeding sheep.
Looks like you will need to introduce livestock .

That was the exact plan this year. I did chicken out though as we are on heavy clay and having not done it before i was worried about making too much of a mess. There was a cover crop broadcast with a shallow cultivation but it didn’t come very well (apart from vol barley) so I was also worried that because it had been moved slightly it would compact more. I am learning on this stuff

 

[ajd132]

What's the current field state, stubble or worked ground?

Shallow worked 2-3 inches and had a cover crop broadcast at the same time which didn’t come very well so it is mostly vol barley on it.

 

[Spud]

That was the exact plan this year. I did chicken out though as we are on heavy clay and having not done it before i was worried about making too much of a mess. There was a cover crop broadcast with a shallow cultivation but it didn’t come very well (apart from vol barley) so I was also worried that because it had been moved slightly it would compact more. I am learning on this stuff

By the sounds of it the shallow cultivation chitted the barley but the dry Sept was too much for the cc.

Better imo to direct drill the cover than cultivate and broadcast. That said, mine are nothing special this year either!

 

[ajd132]

By the sounds of it the shallow cultivation chitted the barley but the dry Sept was too much for the cc.

Better imo to direct drill the cover than cultivate and broadcast. That said, mine are nothing special this year either!

I agree. It’s just trying to manage risk with spring crops at the moment 2-3 inches of tilth has been giving us 2t/ha more than proper zero till at the moment. I can’t ignore that on other people’s land to try and be completely purist. I am working on it all though.

 

[lloyd]

That was the exact plan this year. I did chicken out though as we are on heavy clay and having not done it before i was worried about making too much of a mess. There was a cover crop broadcast with a shallow cultivation but it didn’t come very well (apart from vol barley) so I was also worried that because it had been moved slightly it would compact more. I am learning on this stuff

You need to keep rotating the sheep so they
are not treading the same ground for too long.
Yes you will waste some animal food in the process
but that's not the real object of the excercise.
Regular checking of the livestock will determine
best time to move .
Put 5-6 decent size store lambs an acre on good regrowth,
last about 6weeks per acre with me.

 

[neilo]

You need to keep rotating the sheep so they
are not treading the same ground for too long.
Yes you will waste some animal food in the process
but that's not the real object of the excercise.
Regular checking of the livestock will determine
best time to move .
Put 5-6 decent size store lambs an acre on good regrowth,
last about 6weeks per acre with me.

Are you on clay soil though?

I have sheep, but I know that if I graze them hard enough to kill the volunteer barley & associated greenery, it would cap our clay soil enough that I would struggle to DD for a good while after. This year, worse than ever.
I'd go with a low dose of glyphosate if I was looking to DD any time soon or, if I could do with the keep (and who doesn't this year), I would graze it and delay drilling.

 

[whiddy]

Don't want to be going to early if your on clay and blackgrass, mid March would be best.

 

[lloyd]

Are you on clay soil though?

I have sheep, but I know that if I graze them hard enough to kill the volunteer barley & associated greenery, it would cap our clay soil enough that I would struggle to DD for a good while after. This year, worse than ever.
I'd go with a low dose of glyphosate if I was looking to DD any time soon or, if I could do with the keep (and who doesn't this year), I would graze it and delay drilling.

Got a mixture of soil types .
I did put low stocking rate per acre and rotate
around fields .
Have gone straight into after turnips last year with Mtzuri
and had good crop of S.barley so depends what drill
you use and not too many seasons like this one.

 

[Will7]

Got second spring barley and spring wheat going into volunteer spring barley as soon as it dries up enough. I am planning to spray off ASAP as worried about effects
Of cereal after cereal. Is this the best way to proceed? I will also point out that my drill has liquid fert on it and I will be putting a big dose of the N under the seed at planting.

I did this with limited success. Sprayed the barley volunteers off around Xmas from memory. Drilled with a seedhawk with placed dap and all the chopped barley straw masked blackgrass, slugs and net blotch....
1st barley. 9t/ha
2nd barley. 7t/ha
3rd barley. 5t/ha destroyed by net blotch

Now cultivating again......

 

[ajd132]

I did this with limited success. Sprayed the barley volunteers off around Xmas from memory. Drilled with a seedhawk with placed dap and all the chopped barley straw masked blackgrass, slugs and net blotch....
1st barley. 9t/ha
2nd barley. 7t/ha
3rd barley. 5t/ha destroyed by net blotch

Now cultivating again......

Soil has been cultivated but also broadcast a CC which didn’t come very well but a lot of volunteers grew. we have grown second barley successfully in the past.
currently spraying off.

 

[Robert]

What rate of Glyphosate / wetters / etc do you use for this exercise under prevailing conditions etc please?

 

[yellow belly]

My plan after cover of oats and weeds and volunteers

spray off from feb onwards as soon as possible then spray again at drilling if there is any uncontrollable weeds in the crop
in a previous year I could not spray off all spring cropping fields due to weather this allowed the cover to keep using up soil nitrogen which is detrimental to the crop and in a dry year uses up soil moisture

 

[Brisel]

Destroy the volunteers ASAP to reduce the disease carry over and consider treating any farm saved seed to reduce the disease burden. I've grown second spring barley crops to change cropping rotation and break up block cropping. There's always more disease and the yield is a bit less but it's always manageable and certainly reduces grass weeds too.