Spring barley looking poor...

[Chae1]

In my experience direct drilling of spring crops to conserve moisture is the biggest myth of all times

interesting because the top few inches of soil were bone dry when we were ploughing end march/start april so id imagine direct drilling into that wouldnt be ideal, however ploughing was bringing up damper soil from below, the drill was basically following the plough and heavy grass rollers behind drill, surely this is the way to do it in a dry spring? fert down spout and muck ploughed in!

I'd tend to agree with you with regards to direct drilling not conserving moisture. I planned to try one on our sand next spring but going off the idea.

They seem to have gone very quiet during this dry spell. They were quick to point out at the start over cultivating could be reason for our soil not being so water retentive.

 

[Bossfarmer]

I'd tend to agree with you with regards to direct drilling not conserving moisture. I planned to try one on our sand next spring but going off the idea.

They seem to have gone very quiet during this dry spell. They were quick to point out at the start over cultivating could be reason for our soil not being so water retentive.

i cant get away from the fact that the only way to get some moisture up in a dry spell it to plough it up, a direct drill wont go deep enough, obviously guys with heavier soils have to work it a lot and thats where the moistures lost unless mabye uve a powerharrow infront, one on drill and someone rolling behind, clearly the direct drill saves a lot of staff and machinery but can it be relied on? its a balancing act, dont see it stacking up for smaller guys like myself that just do their own ground and heavy muck applications

 

[SilliamWhale]

It is not because you ploughed wet down, it is more that by ploughing you aerated a severely rain compacted top couple of inches of soil. A couple of inches that through 6 months of heavy rainfall had lost plenty of it's nutrients, by ploughing you brought more to the surface, mineralised N and your crop got its roots developing early on. In my experience direct drilling of spring crops to conserve moisture is the biggest myth of all times, it is all about establishment at the right time, well sown is half gown. Been spraying T2 on SB all day and have one very steep field that can only be direct drilled (can't pull Topdown up it) that faces North so hanging in there and looking ok. The best SB is all after potatoes with a destroyed soil structure yet nutrients retained via an oil radish cover crop at the surface. With over 600 acres of SB and similar rainfall some is 2ft tall and some 10 inches, the best crops are all those that had proper cultivations early on. Spring crops need to get up and away as quickly as possible.

What were the previous crops in the direct drilled field?

 

[SilliamWhale]

I'd tend to agree with you with regards to direct drilling not conserving moisture. I planned to try one on our sand next spring but going off the idea.

They seem to have gone very quiet during this dry spell. They were quick to point out at the start over cultivating could be reason for our soil not being so water retentive.

I think its all to do with timing rather than DD.

The tillage boys probably sowed a little earlier and this year thats been a better thing as it has been dry from April onwards. I could show you pictures of some excellent winter crops and some not so good spring crops all DD but at the end of the day its all about it being a bit dry whatever the establishment method. The earlier sown crops have just had a better root system. Last year was different as it was a great spring crop growing season, next year will be different too.

A lot of the world no tills to conserve moisture. Its a pretty common theme in the dry areas.

 

[Properjob]

A lot of the world use direct drilling as it is cheap and the only option to cover a mass acreage where yields are low. Yields are not normally low in Western Europe with our normal temperate climate. Normally we have sufficient rainfall post sowing to maintain our crops, and no matter what system you you use when your soil is too dry it is too dry. What is very evident from most crops this spring is those that were planted early into moisture are looking much better. I am not anti direct drilling and all our beans were planted at 4 inches with a 750a and looking good. All the early drilled SB looks good but the later drilled stuff is much poorer as soils became more dry. If there is no moisture at drilling depth then you get a failure if no rain follows. If you bring moisture to the surface through a deep cultivation or ploughing then you will get better establishment and equally if you have 6 months of torrential rain a lot of nutrients will get lost from the top few inches of soil. It is an unfortunate season for everyone but when I look over the hedge at my neighbours SB, all ploughed and combi drilled it looks ok at the moment!

 

[ajd132]

light (for us) land second spring barley feeling the heat now. Was drilled into a cover crop.

 

[Devon James]

Interesting debate. Will join in again later

 

[SilliamWhale]

A lot of the world use direct drilling as it is cheap and the only option to cover a mass acreage where yields are low. Yields are not normally low in Western Europe with our normal temperate climate. Normally we have sufficient rainfall post sowing to maintain our crops, and no matter what system you you use when your soil is too dry it is too dry. What is very evident from most crops this spring is those that were planted early into moisture are looking much better. I am not anti direct drilling and all our beans were planted at 4 inches with a 750a and looking good. All the early drilled SB looks good but the later drilled stuff is much poorer as soils became more dry. If there is no moisture at drilling depth then you get a failure if no rain follows. If you bring moisture to the surface through a deep cultivation or ploughing then you will get better establishment and equally if you have 6 months of torrential rain a lot of nutrients will get lost from the top few inches of soil. It is an unfortunate season for everyone but when I look over the hedge at my neighbours SB, all ploughed and combi drilled it looks ok at the moment!

I'd probably agree with you there about drilling into moisture. It is unusally dry this year though for the time of year. So its a hindsight/ timing thing. But your argument about ploughing up moisture is the same one people use to plough up dry soil as well.

I'm not sure if nutrients washed down get lost from the top few inches of soil or not. Nitrogen probably, P and K I don't think.

 

[Zippy768]

What were/are peoples plans for SB t2?
Better stuff is about there now. Looking showery for next 10 days - probably wont come to anything

 

[teslacoils]

Proline as late as allowed. Not a lot.

 

[robbie]

Either a small dose of proline or half a litre of fandango. I wont give it much but feel it needs something.

 

[tw15]

Just done some on our worst ground recon might just get 100 -120 tons off 27 ha if it gets moisture . As for straw I recon 3 six stringers max more like 2 its short and thin and is droughting out in big patches . Next up is roughly 30 ha after lunch that is on better ground will report back latter .

 

[Spencer]

Just done some on our worst ground recon might just get 100 -120 tons off 27 ha if it gets moisture . As for straw I recon 3 six stringers max more like 2 its short and thin and is droughting out in big patches . Next up is roughly 30 ha after lunch that is on better ground will report back latter .

What with?

 

[Brisel]

£19/ha on 0.4 Elatus Era for rust & ramularia plus left over magnesium nitrate from an ibc (65pence/litre)

 

[T Hectares]

Focusing on Rust and brackling here
£17/ha on Priaxxor EC on half the area, the rest getting Imtrex and Proline ( left over in the store from OSR) around £22/ha
Plus Mn and Bittersaltz


Wheats getting either Teb or Azoxy as that's what I had planned for OSR flowering spray and didn't apply it in the end + Mn and bittersalz

T3's started this morning...

 

[Brisel]

Nice picture! Have you been polishing the tractor?

 

[T Hectares]

Nice picture! Have you been polishing the tractor?

Ha, no it was just a lovely light at 5 this morning !!

 

[Jo28]

My next job is going round spraying off wheat and spring barley with glyphosate, the rain came too late and they won't be worth combining.

 

[yellow belly]

i cant get away from the fact that the only way to get some moisture up in a dry spell it to plough it up, a direct drill wont go deep enough, obviously guys with heavier soils have to work it a lot and thats where the moistures lost unless mabye uve a powerharrow infront, one on drill and someone rolling behind, clearly the direct drill saves a lot of staff and machinery but can it be relied on? its a balancing act, dont see it stacking up for smaller guys like myself that just do their own ground and heavy muck applications

If you let the ground dry out then ploughing is a way to get moisture up but you do bury dry soil
the more soil moved round here the more diesel needed to get it fine enough
the only ploughed land has maize on it or is light land
most of the light land got planted with wheat between October and February

in Australia where they have proper dry weather and notill crops they just notill deeper to get the seed into the moisture

here on heavy land the key in dry springs is to drill into moisture when the surface is dry enough
if I need to wait because of a drilling delay for weed control then a layer of chopped straw and cover crop debris keeps the moisture in the top few inches
the More years a field has been notill the easier it is to time
my 9 year notill is better than 5 year notill
and those I know have been doing it for 15 or more years it is better than my 9 years notill

 

[Wombat]

My next job is going round spraying off wheat and spring barley with glyphosate, the rain came too late and they won't be worth combining.

Sorry to read that we really seem to have been stuck In the sh!t weather zone since sept.