The great global warming scam, worth a listen I think.

[wilber]

His mind is probably still addled from the copious amounts of LSD he used to take... ask the glowing green racoon.

The man is also a biochemist with no experience or research around anything climate related.

 

[banjo]

This guy also denies aids and believes in astrology.

I'm talking about the climate, nothing else before people start tagging me with other things.

 

[banjo]

His mind is probably still addled from the copious amounts of LSD he used to take... ask the glowing green racoon.

The man is also a biochemist with no experience or research around anything climate related.

Pretty much all climate modellers have no clue about the climate and I've learnt on this thread people attack the man not the ball when the evidence shows they are wrong!

 

[Farmer Roy]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10156766400354769

 

[Farmer Roy]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1862021617162653

 

[Courier]

As governments notice reduced tax revenue from fossil fuel they will undoubtedly find a way to tax electric travel .

 

[wilber]

Pretty much all climate modellers have no clue about the climate and I've learnt on this thread people attack the man not the ball when the evidence shows they are wrong!

I know right, we should never question someones background when taking advice... I'm just off to ring the mccann's for child care advice when on holiday in a foreign country.

 

[Dave645]

As governments notice reduced tax revenue from fossil fuel they will undoubtedly find a way to tax electric travel .

This is the real barrier, big business cannot see a way to charge people for free energy if we are producing our own, this is why they lobby for changes to make it less economic all the while installing as much as they can, the USA is allowing this to happen, they are actively changing things to discourage self installed systems like solar electric, all the while the power companies and putting them in, in growing amounts because they can profit from them greatly because they can charge what they like for the electric they produce. A home owner only gets 2p but the power companies sell it for 16p and sell power from their own solar systems for 16p, it’s monopilies moving to control the market by squeezing out home owners from the market. With legislation changes, By making it as unprofitable as possible.

If anyone wants an electric car you also need to think about investing in solar and a battery store if you cannot charge your car at home in the day time.
over next 10 years or so batteries and solar panels will continue to fall in price, if they are not already justifiable to buy without any sub they soon will be. Even if the power companies are robbing you on your exported electric, but with battery stores you will keep that to a minimum anyway.

Renewable energy has upset big business, this push to renewables was created from climate change worries, now I truly believe we are living in a complex system that’s called the solar system, and I am sure it plays it’s part in the Earth climate but so do we, no one thing effects our climate, mans infulances are not small or irrelevant, but they are only one cog, in the system but what’s important to except is we do play a role.

By moving our planet to as close as possible to fully renewable energy we will take billions of people out of fuel poverty, how else will the third world power cars if not from free energy from the sun, but if big business wins the arguments they will block that if at all possible, because they cannot charge for that family living in the Sudan powering their home with solar, or that African state producing clean drinking water from sea water with free solar energy, or producing water to irrigate crops. So they can feed them selves, renewables are the way to go but this upsets big business.... so they fight the trigger for the changes, in a hope to slow down the push for renewables, if that fails they try to change the rules so they can profit more from your solar roof than you do........

 

[Dave645]

Pretty much all climate modellers have no clue about the climate and I've learnt on this thread people attack the man not the ball when the evidence shows they are wrong!

I agree that the models don’t get every thing right, and climate science has still a lot to learn but, you have agreed that climate change is real, you only argue the cause, now up to now we have had a long term trend for climate temperatures rising, weather patterns shifting, and so on, now your happy to admit this as natural climate change, but not that mans influence has had any hand in it, now you predict we will see a long term trend of climate cooling which I hope we get, it would be good if things returned to 1980 levels, but for me it’s to soon to tell definitively, we have had dips before they were only short term dips of a few years, so before we can rejoice in your correct predictions we need this trend to carry on, we need weather patterns to settle back to normal, if that’s the correct word.
So before you declare a victory and that all climate models know nothing where you do, let’s give it some time, at least see how this year rounds out like, before we trash all those climate change predictions totally.
You personally said we will see a hot summer in the UK what if that rounds out the year with globule average temperatures up so still on climate models predicted trend? And that the last few months are not what you believe, as the end of warming?

 

[Dave645]

Sorry one more, this is for farmers.
I actualy see farming has having a good chance to profit from solar and electric cars, we can become the fuel stations of the country, we can sell our own freely generated power direct to the consumers, we don’t need the national grid or any unknown tech just a solar panel system, battery storage and a fast charge station, we can then sell directly to the motoring public, we become the rural filling stations of old that every village had, sure we need a field next to a road suitable for the panels but that’s really it, over the next few years as battery tech and battery charge systems on electric cars get more standardised, things will get simpler, as will installing a system and hardware to make a charge station cheap to build and manage. Throw in a wind turbine to cover winter generation limits or just go into a contract for drawing power from the national grid when needed and or import export agreements with the national grid to export power onto the grid at peak times. Would create a very good little business from a field... and very little labour once setup.

 

[wanton dwarf]

I agree that the models don’t get every thing right, and climate science has still a lot to learn but, you have agreed that climate change is real, you only argue the cause, now up to now we have had a long term trend for climate temperatures rising, weather patterns shifting, and so on, now your happy to admit this as natural climate change, but not that mans influence has had any hand in it, now you predict we will see a long term trend of climate cooling which I hope we get, it would be good if things returned to 1980 levels, but for me it’s to soon to tell definitively, we have had dips before they were only short term dips of a few years, so before we can rejoice in your correct predictions we need this trend to carry on, we need weather patterns to settle back to normal, if that’s the correct word.
So before you declare a victory and that all climate models know nothing where you do, let’s give it some time, at least see how this year rounds out like, before we trash all those climate change predictions totally.
You personally said we will see a hot summer in the UK what if that rounds out the year with globule average temperatures up so still on climate models predicted trend? And that the last few months are not what you believe, as the end of warming?

Shock horror the climate changes.

It's been changing for billions of years.

Ask yourself a simple question, if Climate Change is so Earth shatteringly disasterous why have governments exported industry to countries 1000s of miles away to produce exactly the same goods using far dirtier energy supplies.

Add into that the local environmental damage, the transport pollution and the chaos caused by UK industrial job losses.

It's a scam.
It's all about money, instead of local people earning money, making a profit, paying taxes, someone has setup companies in China using far lower wages and now they make money not the local people - stuff the fact it's far more polluting - and lets face it, there's lots of people only too happy to facilitate the scam, make the UK poorer and damage the environment.

The climate was just the excuse to destroy local industry through taxes.

All this talk about "Average temperatures" ... we are coming out of an ice age, do you expect temperatures to go down or up ?

And to give you an even bigger clue .. Ice ages and ice caps on the Earth are not the norm. During the Earths life time each successive ice age was deeper and longer.

Be thankful and hopeful humans have turned the tide and hopefully there won't be another ice age .. because in the last ice age almost all Humans and most land based life died out.

 

[Dave645]

Ask yourself a simple question, if Climate Change is so Earth shatteringly disasterous why have governments exported industry to countries 1000s of miles away to produce exactly the same goods using far dirtier energy supplies.

That’s simple the price, it’s what drives all business, you assume the govermants have exported industries, this is not the case business is about money, the money was found in exporting production away from expensive labour areas to where cheap labour was plentiful. Was that good long term no, do I agree with it again no, but, it’s like farming it’s all about margin, UK farming would be very hard without sub, the Chinese govermants understood this, so heavenly supported its industry, this often alowed products to be produced at less than cost, I do mean this, I know a dealer that traded with a Chinese company for top links for its product when negotiating they ask the price, the company said what’s your offer, so they sat down and costed how much the steel by weight would cost in a top arm they wanted, and offered this as an opening bid, to there surprise it was excepted, after the deal was signed they ask how can you do this deal the steel alone cost what we are paying, they turned around and said the govermants will cover the rest........ it’s things like this that drove production to stop in other counties that abided by world trade agreements.... no support for exports... China has been very clever and taken advantage of or capitalist greed and consumer need for cheaper stuff.
Climate change has no bearing on these choices and never has.

I will ask you, look up
California’s water wars.
Uncontrolled climate change is the only thing that’s of any importance, full stop. Climate change if the trend continues even if it has bumps on the road, is having effects all around the world, truthfully climate change has started good trends new job opportunities, actualy the cheap dirty industries that we lost can comeback if we can lower our costs to a point to cover the import costs from China, lower energy cost is a big factor in this.

I will add millions of years ago we were not supporting 7 billion people with food and water...... unless you only want to look after some of them....?

 

[graham99]

This is the real barrier, big business cannot see a way to charge people for free energy if we are producing our own, this is why they lobby for changes to make it less economic all the while installing as much as they can, the USA is allowing this to happen, they are actively changing things to discourage self installed systems like solar electric, all the while the power companies and putting them in, in growing amounts because they can profit from them greatly because they can charge what they like for the electric they produce. A home owner only gets 2p but the power companies sell it for 16p and sell power from their own solar systems for 16p, it’s monopilies moving to control the market by squeezing out home owners from the market. With legislation changes, By making it as unprofitable as possible.

If anyone wants an electric car you also need to think about investing in solar and a battery store if you cannot charge your car at home in the day time.
over next 10 years or so batteries and solar panels will continue to fall in price, if they are not already justifiable to buy without any sub they soon will be. Even if the power companies are robbing you on your exported electric, but with battery stores you will keep that to a minimum anyway.

Renewable energy has upset big business, this push to renewables was created from climate change worries, now I truly believe we are living in a complex system that’s called the solar system, and I am sure it plays it’s part in the Earth climate but so do we, no one thing effects our climate, mans infulances are not small or irrelevant, but they are only one cog, in the system but what’s important to except is we do play a role.

By moving our planet to as close as possible to fully renewable energy we will take billions of people out of fuel poverty, how else will the third world power cars if not from free energy from the sun, but if big business wins the arguments they will block that if at all possible, because they cannot charge for that family living in the Sudan powering their home with solar, or that African state producing clean drinking water from sea water with free solar energy, or producing water to irrigate crops. So they can feed them selves, renewables are the way to go but this upsets big business.... so they fight the trigger for the changes, in a hope to slow down the push for renewables, if that fails they try to change the rules so they can profit more from your solar roof than you do........

hit the nail on the head.
what the people do not know is oil per gram has more energy then anything else.
the real problem is big business have built their business around that energy

 

[wanton dwarf]

That’s simple the price, it’s what drives all business, you assume the govermants have exported industries, this is not the case business is about money, the money was found in exporting production away from expensive labour areas to where cheap labour was plentiful. Was that good long term no, do I agree with it again no, but, it’s like farming it’s all about margin, UK farming would be very hard without sub, the Chinese govermants understood this, so heavenly supported its industry, this often alowed products to be produced at less than cost, I do mean this, I know a dealer that traded with a Chinese company for top links for its product when negotiating they ask the price, the company said what’s your offer, so they sat down and costed how much the steel by weight would cost in a top arm they wanted, and offered this as an opening bid, to there surprise it was excepted, after the deal was signed they ask how can you do this deal the steel alone cost what we are paying, they turned around and said the govermants will cover the rest........ it’s things like this that drove production to stop in other counties that abided by world trade agreements.... no support for exports... China has been very clever and taken advantage of or capitalist greed and consumer need for cheaper stuff.
Climate change has no bearing on these choices and never has.

I will ask you, look up
California’s water wars.
Uncontrolled climate change is the only thing that’s of any importance, full stop. Climate change if the trend continues even if it has bumps on the road, is having effects all around the world, truthfully climate change has started good trends new job opportunities, actualy the cheap dirty industries that we lost can comeback if we can lower our costs to a point to cover the import costs from China, lower energy cost is a big factor in this.

I will add millions of years ago we were not supporting 7 billion people with food and water...... unless you only want to look after some of them....?

Climate change taxes are facilitated by government.
The lack of import taxes is facilitated by government.
Energy policy is created by government.
Trade negotiations are create by governments.

It's got nothing to do with business at all. Business just takes whatever system exists.

Climate change has EVERYTHING to do with these choices because the costs of transport, fuel and energy are a major component in production - especially metals. Taxing those in the West whilst not taxing everyone else ... any guesses who is going to progress and who is not ?

Climate change is pure drivel created as a reason to take money of joe public in the West and put it in the pockets of billionaires which don't identify with any country.

Your last point about people.

As a farmer you should know it takes a required amount of inputs to sustain life, be it plant - animal - insect - reptile.

Should be very obvious to you that given we dig up materials, like phosphates, coal (carbon, phosphate) that those materails for life are increasing .. should be very obvious in the time (100s of millions of years ago) when those minerals were buried life gradually decreased in abundance and size.

QED .. welcome to farming life on a global scale .. which obviously makes the Climate lunatics look like exactly what they are .. usefull idiots helping the super rich subjigate the poor in the West, transferring money from the many to the few.

 

[wanton dwarf]

hit the nail on the head.
what the people do not know is oil per gram has more energy then anything else.
the real problem is big business have built their business around that energy

Whilst the rest of the world carries on using oil you can try and compete and fail.

As you rightly say oil wins at every level .. you try competing with "Renewables" you'll have no business - which is exactly what those who don't rely on your business want.

After all they've built a massive container port in London just for that purpose .. do you think they aren't going to sway the system to ensure they win and you don't ?

Let's put it the easy way .. you are helping them destroy yourselves, not only yourselves but the future of everyone. When it gets to a stage of where you cannot possibly compete with what were 3rd world nations .. nothing you say or do will matter. You'll just have to put up with what you are given.

 

[Dave645]

Climate change taxes are facilitated by government.
The lack of import taxes is facilitated by government..

All true but these are negotiations for mutual trade agreements it cuts both ways for import export tariffs. One country will never get it all there own way....

Climate change is pure drivel created as a reason to take money of joe public in the West and put it in the pockets of billionaires which don't identify with any country.
.

Even this threads owner exepts that climate change is real, he only contests humans part in it or at least the size of our effect on it.
To say climate change is not a threat to life is very silly, be it natural or man made, one food or water shortage will bring a county to riots.... we are already seeing mass migrations sure these are mostly due to wars but the effect is the same disruptions are far wider than just the country directly effected.
We are nearing day zero in Cape Town, South Africa. These are real problem, that climate change has a hand in......

I can see you have strong opinions on what has happened near you to industry and you think it’s all due to climate change, but it’s not, it’s never as simple as that. Industries were in decline in the uk well before climate change taxes were ever created so to base an argument that they are the sole cause is not looking at the larger picture. The coal industry fell due to bad management and price pressure from massive open cast mines producing coal for next to nothing. Steel industry was due to China messing with subsidies on their end, and our govermants lost there bottle and stop supporting ours. The car industry was out performed by other countries in lots of areas including quality and price, but you cannot say that they have had no help they had lots.

 

[Dave645]

Whilst the rest of the world carries on using oil you can try and compete and fail.

As you rightly say oil wins at every level .. you try competing with "Renewables" you'll have no business - which is exactly what those who don't rely on your business want.

After all they've built a massive container port in London just for that purpose .. do you think they aren't going to sway the system to ensure they win and you don't ?

Let's put it the easy way .. you are helping them destroy yourselves, not only yourselves but the future of everyone. When it gets to a stage of where you cannot possibly compete with what were 3rd world nations .. nothing you say or do will matter. You'll just have to put up with what you are given.

Oil loses on all levels on price and availability anyone who bases a business around long term oil energy will lose even the oil producers are moving to solar to power the pumps that pump it out of the ground, no shipping involved to get solar power.... one of our strongest producers Germany have seen the light they have pushed renewable tech far harder, and are now getting the benefits it radically under cuts oil based power.

 

[wanton dwarf]

All true but these are negotiations for mutual trade agreements it cuts both ways for import export tariffs. One country will never get it all there own way....

Even this threads owner exepts that climate change is real, he only contests humans part in it or at least the size of our effect on it.
To say climate change is not a threat to life is very silly, be it natural or man made, one food or water shortage will bring a county to riots.... we are already seeing mass migrations sure these are mostly due to wars but the effect is the same disruptions are far wider than just the country directly effected.
We are nearing day zero in Cape Town, South Africa. These are real problem, that climate change has a hand in......

I can see you have strong opinions on what has happened near you to industry and you think it’s all due to climate change, but it’s not, it’s never as simple as that. Industries were in decline in the uk well before climate change taxes were ever created so to base an argument that they are the sole cause is not looking at the larger picture. The coal industry fell due to bad management and price pressure from massive open cast mines producing coal for next to nothing. Steel industry was due to China messing with subsidies on their end, and our govermants lost there bottle and stop supporting ours. The car industry was out performed by other countries in lots of areas including quality and price, but you cannot say that they have had no help they had lots.

They DO get it all their own way because China and most of the world doesn't pay Climate Taxes.

Climate Change is rubbish.

If it was real then why pollute the planet more by creating Climate taxes .. QED .. it's just an excercise in moving money from the poor to the rich.

That's all it is .. you don't even admit pollution is worse because of Climate Taxes, you don't admit those producing goods now cause more pollution, you don't admit that transport pollution is a LOT worse, nor do you admit that "Renewables" create even more pollution because they are so inefficient AND they again are produced 1000s of miles away .. UK waste sent to China to be .. thrown in the sea .. yet UK tax payers pay £1000s for "Recycling".

It's a scam where even those supporting it can't justify it and can't even prove it exists .. every single document put out by "Climate Scientists" has been wrong .. to the effect that if it was a "Scientific" exercise the margin of error is unacceptable .. ie it's not scientific.

This is purely a political excercise in moving money .. and the best part about it is it causes far more pollution. Not only in what I've described but in increasing GDP in none Western countries they of course cause FAR FAR FAR FAR (Repeat to infiinity) more pollution because they now have BILLIONS more consumers.

It's beyond ridiculous .. it's not even funny.

 

[linga]

They DO get it all their own way because China and most of the world doesn't pay Climate Taxes.

Climate Change is rubbish.

If it was real then why pollute the planet more by creating Climate taxes .. QED .. it's just an excercise in moving money from the poor to the rich.

That's all it is .. you don't even admit pollution is worse because of Climate Taxes, you don't admit those producing goods now cause more pollution, you don't admit that transport pollution is a LOT worse, nor do you admit that "Renewables" create even more pollution because they are so inefficient AND they again are produced 1000s of miles away .. UK waste sent to China to be .. thrown in the sea .. yet UK tax payers pay £1000s for "Recycling".

It's a scam where even those supporting it can't justify it and can't even prove it exists .. every single document put out by "Climate Scientists" has been wrong .. to the effect that if it was a "Scientific" exercise the margin of error is unacceptable .. ie it's not scientific.

This is purely a political excercise in moving money .. and the best part about it is it causes far more pollution. Not only in what I've described but in increasing GDP in none Western countries they of course cause FAR FAR FAR FAR (Repeat to infiinity) more pollution because they now have BILLIONS more consumers.

It's beyond ridiculous .. it's not even funny.

You have proof then that every single document put out by climate scientists is wrong ?

 

[wanton dwarf]

Oil loses on all levels on price and availability anyone who bases a business around long term oil energy will lose even the oil producers are moving to solar to power the pumps that pump it out of the ground, no shipping involved to get solar power.... one of our strongest producers Germany have seen the light they have pushed renewable tech far harder, and are now getting the benefits it radically under cuts oil based power.

No they aren't.

Oil isn't going to run out magically any time soon .. supplies have never been larger and the move towards gas, which is a waste gas usually burnt off in oil fields .. means supplies will continue probably for over 100 years at least.

Still zero reasons other than ideology whilst the "supposed" environmental reasons are the opposite.

Germany dropped Nuclear and went coal .. where do you get this rubbish from ? They even went with Lignite which is the most polluting form of coal there is.

And let's face it .. the current "Greening" rules came in because Germany decided it was a good idea to plant one crop .. without hedges .. which led to everyone in the EU having to plant 3 crops mandatory.

On every level "Renewables" is not very good .. and it doesn't undercut oil based power at all. Withou subsidied no "Renewables" would be viable. Try selling renewable power at 6p a unit to justify the costs .. what planet do you live on ?