GS4 Herbal ley.

[PaulNix]

HI, want a bit of advice please, I been reading up on the GS4 option for mid tier and land agent said " You understand you need to replace it within 5 yrs! " as I understood you could move it as in seed out another area with a Herbal ley as long as you had the same area but he made it sound as you HAD to plough it up and put it somewhere else during that time, ofc I had an emergency cow calving phone call before I could question him more but as I read it doesn't mean you have too just that you can.
Any help from those who are already doing this option would be appreciated as it would change the area I would put in.

https://www.gov.uk/countryside-stewardship-grants/legume-and-herb-rich-swards-gs4#requirements

 

[teslacoils]

I think the agent is suggesting that you risk it becoming classed as permenent pasture. They all fear this . No idea why.

 

[PaulNix]

Thanks that's all i could come up with as well mulling it over today.

 

[Princess Pooper]

HI, want a bit of advice please, I been reading up on the GS4 option for mid tier and land agent said " You understand you need to replace it within 5 yrs! " as I understood you could move it as in seed out another area with a Herbal ley as long as you had the same area but he made it sound as you HAD to plough it up and put it somewhere else during that time, ofc I had an emergency cow calving phone call before I could question him more but as I read it doesn't mean you have too just that you can.
Any help from those who are already doing this option would be appreciated as it would change the area I would put in.

https://www.gov.uk/countryside-stewardship-grants/legume-and-herb-rich-swards-gs4#requirements

You only need to re-establish it (on the same or another field, doesn't matter) if your species mix drops below the minimum % specified eg it warns about cheap red clover seed not being persistent.

 

[CiderJan]

Also interested in the GS4 payment ley.

Just wandering if I could put nearly all the farm into it, work the scheme and run a simpler, lower stocked system.

What % of a holding have people managed to get in the scheme?

 

[steveR]

Also interested in the GS4 payment ley.

Just wandering if I could put nearly all the farm into it, work the scheme and run a simpler, lower stocked system.

What % of a holding have people managed to get in the scheme?

What would the GS4 be replacing?

 

[teslacoils]

Also interested in the GS4 payment ley.

Just wandering if I could put nearly all the farm into it, work the scheme and run a simpler, lower stocked system.

What % of a holding have people managed to get in the scheme?

Yes, you can put almost 100 percent in under the mixed farming offer. You'd be limited to organic manures, and a few cutting restrictions.

 

[steveR]

Yes, you can put almost 100 percent in under the mixed farming offer. You'd be limited to organic manures, and a few cutting restrictions.

The prescriptions says:

• manage the sward by cutting or grazing
• leave the sward to rest for at least 5 weeks between 1 May and 31 July, so that the majority of red clover flowers are open and available for pollinators.

@CiderJan will need to make sure there is enough area in GS4 or other grazing, to remove stock from part of the area for those 5 weeks. I reckoned with some care and planning, this could be achieved here...

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Also interested in the GS4 payment ley.

Just wandering if I could put nearly all the farm into it, work the scheme and run a simpler, lower stocked system.

What % of a holding have people managed to get in the scheme?

As far as I understand, there are 2 payment rates; one for grazed and one for ungrazed (presumably they want you to cut this instead which seems completely bonkers from a wildlife perspective). The grazed idea sounds very tempting if you have livestock.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

GS4: Legume and herb-rich swards

Find out about eligibility and requirements for the legume and herb-rich swards option.

www.gov.uk

This has some of the rules but the payment rates are not crystal clear

 

[Princess Pooper]

I would always be wary of locking up too much of a grassland farm into restrictions - you may need to allow for contingencies.

Not just looking at the restrictions of the option above, but in general, with other grassland options as well, remember to allow for bad weather, supplementary feeding, the need to reseed if you need, weed control, (whether chemical or topping), clean ground if TB restricted, enough ground to spread your muck on (esp if in an NVZ) without (for example) losing suitable dry cow grazing, the ability to pop a bit more N on if you need to graze a sward a bit tighter than they allow, because you are short of forage.

We have had over 60% of our grassland in options for over the last 20 years and I wouldn't have wanted to tie any more up than that. They will allow you to vary it (if you request it formally) for example due to severe drought, but you can't go asking for variations (derogations) every 5 minutes.

 

[steveR]

I would always be wary of locking up too much of a grassland farm into restrictions - you may need to allow for contingencies.

Not just looking at the restrictions of the option above, but in general, with other grassland options as well, remember to allow for bad weather, supplementary feeding, the need to reseed if you need, weed control, (whether chemical or topping), clean ground if TB restricted, enough ground to spread your muck on (esp if in an NVZ) without (for example) losing suitable dry cow grazing, the ability to pop a bit more N on if you need to graze a sward a bit tighter than they allow, because you are short of forage.

We have had over 60% of our grassland in options for over the last 20 years and I wouldn't have wanted to tie any more up than that. They will allow you to vary it (if you request it formally) for example due to severe drought, but you can't go asking for variations (derogations) every 5 minutes.

Excellent points PP.

 

[CiderJan]

Just considering options really. We are 100% grass based currently and to fully utilise grass I really need to build more sheds but can't justify it on suckler returns. Makes you think why not work the system.

Good point about rotating to allow some options though. Do like to roundup before a reseed unless docks can count as herbal?

 

[DRC]

As far as I understand, there are 2 payment rates; one for grazed and one for ungrazed (presumably they want you to cut this instead which seems completely bonkers from a wildlife perspective). The grazed idea sounds very tempting if you have livestock.

I’ve never heard of two payment rates.?

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

I’ve never heard of two payment rates.?

Maybe there is more than one option then as although one of them says you can't graze, I am fairly sure there is something similar which you can. So maybe different options rather than different payment rates.

 

[teslacoils]

Maybe you can stack it with a lenient grazing suppliment. 5 week mowing gap can't be hard. Only issue I can see if gap between applying muck and cutting to keep the old poop out of the silage. Just keep the beasts in a shed all the time

 

[Ladybird]

We have done it as part of our mid tier. It’s fantastic. I wish we had done more when we went into mid tier