Hidden buildings/Secret houses.

[suffolksmallholder]

I know a farmer who has built a real masterpiece cottage inside a very ordinary looking portal building. There are fibreglass lights in the wriggly tin walls so it isn’t in complete darkness. He lives here with his family and has done so for twenty or more years. I suppose his children have gone off to do their thing now so it will be just him and his wife living there.
The original farmhouse is still standing 60 metres away and I think it has a grade 2 listing so as ever, it will be cold, damp and pretty nasty to actually live in without huge expensive battles with the ‘authorities’ if he wished to make it habitable.

I think there is a worry of no PP here and Mr Fiddler rather brought this into the fore with his castle-behind-the-hay-stack and the resulting demolition order.
Are there any other folk out there who are treading ‘lightly’ or know someone weaving a fine line with a secret build?
As most on this forum hate to give away their location and I don’t blame y’allcan you please write of these secrets without any fears (I hope) of repercussion.

My build has been very in-your-face with the local authorities even though I changed a lot of the details as it progressed.

SS

 

[Nearly]

I know a builder living in his materials shed on a loft. 150mm kingspan box profile.
Our staff welfare area above the workshop is emergency accomodation if needed.

 

[Still Farming]

Plenty of wize guys about.
Think their planning geniuses, every one owes them a living and got one over on everyone types.
Some that get Certificate of lawfulness after living ,being there for years, never finish building so never get a completion certificate and thus don't pay domestic rates or ever have.
Not on election registers or anything too?
Surprising how many live in part of barns as said above, caravan in sheds or other set ups.
It's the genuine persons that are the one's that get chased for all rules regs, and Bill's everytime.

 

[ollie989898]

I know a farmer who has built a real masterpiece cottage inside a very ordinary looking portal building. There are fibreglass lights in the wriggly tin walls so it isn’t in complete darkness. He lives here with his family and has done so for twenty or more years. I suppose his children have gone off to do their thing now so it will be just him and his wife living there.
The original farmhouse is still standing 60 metres away and I think it has a grade 2 listing so as ever, it will be cold, damp and pretty nasty to actually live in without huge expensive battles with the ‘authorities’ if he wished to make it habitable.

I think there is a worry of no PP here and Mr Fiddler rather brought this into the fore with his castle-behind-the-hay-stack and the resulting demolition order.
Are there any other folk out there who are treading ‘lightly’ or know someone weaving a fine line with a secret build?
As most on this forum hate to give away their location and I don’t blame y’allcan you please write of these secrets without any fears (I hope) of repercussion.

My build has been very in-your-face with the local authorities even though I changed a lot of the details as it progressed.

SS

I see, so you are posting this as a confession to reduce your guilt but implicating another guy at the same time.

 

[Wurzeetoo]

After the wild camping Ban on Dartmoor recently this got me thinking, is it still a recognised law that a house is deemed legally permitted if built overnight and there’s a fire in the Hearth by Morning, or is this possibly Folklore?

 

[suffolksmallholder]

After the wild camping Ban on Dartmoor recently this got me thinking, is it still a recognised law that a house is deemed legally permitted if built overnight and there’s a fire in the Hearth by Morning, or is this possibly Folklore?

I remember hearing this as well.
I renovated a 17th century one room cottage constructed in materials gathered from no more than a mile from the site.
Chalk bricks, round pole timbers and plenty of flint.
With a good gang this could be replicated in a 24 hour time period.
You’ve only to visit Singleton or The Chiltern Open Air Museum to see some of the yeoman's cottages that have been saved and marvel at the skill set of those who cut the timber and the simplicity of the construct.
So to answer your Q; Certainly possible but would you receive a council Red notice? I bet you would but after it was completed and then the battle would start.
SS

 

[suffolksmallholder]

I see, so you are posting this as a confession to reduce your guilt but implicating another guy at the same time.

No confession. All boxes ticked, all regulations adhered to all relevant inspections completed.
Actually some regs higher than set. Fire alarm system which now includes mains CO1 detectors as opposed to Automatic lights in case of a power cut so one doesn’t have to fumble for the torch. 50% more insulation.
The odd pair of windows as opposed to singles as I was agonising while the Council was deliberating.
Not built behind a hay wall or in a portal or scrabbling to be a legal build so future-proofed☺

The hidden building I refer to shows off a skillset which is highly impressive and the detailing is subtle and very in keeping with the original house so if the portal blew away you’d think it had been there since 1690 except that there would be little signs of weathering and things like green moss on the North elevations and leaky gutters
There are a couple of self builds ongoing by members of this forum and the quest to save £’s against creating something pleasant to live in is a constant battle.
Some amazing ex ag buildings have been converted and that in itself is another challenge simply to keep the exterior looking agricultural as the planners require.
SS

 

[Dry Rot]

These says, in certain parts of the country, the council would probably ignore it in the knowledge that if they stopped it, they would have to re-house them.

Not houses, but I do know of industrial premises built and active in complete disregard of the law by both the developer and the council. But it's not what you know but who you know in fraudulent Britain.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

After the wild camping Ban on Dartmoor recently this got me thinking, is it still a recognised law that a house is deemed legally permitted if built overnight and there’s a fire in the Hearth by Morning, or is this possibly Folklore?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-53854853

S4C - Y Ty Cymreig, Cyfres 2007, Tai Unnos

Yn y rhaglen hon o 2006, dilynwn Dorian Bowen a'i freuddwyd o godi 'Ty Unnos' ar ei dir...

www.bbc.co.uk

I didn't see the programme on S4C, but the civils contractor who shuttered my slurry pit wall built one (I think it was filmed for S4C).

 

[Ffermer Bach]

After the wild camping Ban on Dartmoor recently this got me thinking, is it still a recognised law that a house is deemed legally permitted if built overnight and there’s a fire in the Hearth by Morning, or is this possibly Folklore?

I have also heard that, if someone dies, and the coffin is carried over a route to church for burial, a right of way is created over the route the coffin has taken. Has anyone else ever heard of this?

 

[Lofty1984]

Plenty of wize guys about.
Think their planning geniuses, every one owes them a living and got one over on everyone types.
Some that get Certificate of lawfulness after living ,being there for years, never finish building so never get a completion certificate and thus don't pay domestic rates or ever have.
Not on election registers or anything too?
Surprising how many live in part of barns as said above, caravan in sheds or other set ups.
It's the genuine persons that are the one's that get chased for all rules regs, and Bill's everytime.

Didn’t know that about not actually finishing that explains why you see plenty and think Jesus hurry up and finish it after years

 

[milkloss]

I have also heard that, if someone dies, and the coffin is carried over a route to church for burial, a right of way is created over the route the coffin has taken. Has anyone else ever heard of this?

Yes although I have t seen any documentation to prove it. Went to great lengths to follow the foot path when we buried the Old Man just in case.

 

[George from SJM Planning]

Avoiding planning by concealment or knowingly misleading the authorities does not have a time limit on enfocement - as the man who built behind the hay bales found out.

There are many people out there thinking they are clever avoiding planning one way or another but that just produces a steady stream of work for us to do to clear up their mess.

 

[Henarar]

Know a few living in sheds, best of luck to them
At the end of the day planning permission or lack of it is what keeps prices high, simple as that really

 

[Welly Warmer]

I know a farmer who has built a real masterpiece cottage inside a very ordinary looking portal building. There are fibreglass lights in the wriggly tin walls so it isn’t in complete darkness. He lives here with his family and has done so for twenty or more years. I suppose his children have gone off to do their thing now so it will be just him and his wife living there.
The original farmhouse is still standing 60 metres away and I think it has a grade 2 listing so as ever, it will be cold, damp and pretty nasty to actually live in without huge expensive battles with the ‘authorities’ if he wished to make it habitable.

I think there is a worry of no PP here and Mr Fiddler rather brought this into the fore with his castle-behind-the-hay-stack and the resulting demolition order.
Are there any other folk out there who are treading ‘lightly’ or know someone weaving a fine line with a secret build?
As most on this forum hate to give away their location and I don’t blame y’allcan you please write of these secrets without any fears (I hope) of repercussion.

My build has been very in-your-face with the local authorities even though I changed a lot of the details as it progressed.

SS

4 year rule?

 

[George from SJM Planning]

4 year rule?

Not when clearly they knew you are avoiding enforcement

 

[Welly Warmer]

It's not really clear from the op if action is underway/pending. It sounds concealed but is also "in your face" with the LA...

 

[Still Farming]

Some around here just playing with LA all the time.
Put a bit in, withdraw, amend, retrospective, bit more and think their planning Barristers and get on different merits.
As said wize lot out there? (or think they are?)

 

[George from SJM Planning]

Some around here just playing with LA all the time.
Put a bit in, withdraw, amend, retrospective, bit more and think their planning Barristers and get on different merits.
As said wize lot out there? (or think they are?)

A planning barrister tends to make a lowly civil servant go weak at the knees but they also make the applicants pocket empty quickly.
We get barristers at a discounted rate because my boss is RTPI but the cost is still eyewatering enough that we only call on them in extreme cases.

 

[Still Farming]

A planning barrister tends to make a lowly civil servant go weak at the knees but they also make the applicants pocket empty quickly.
We get barristers at a discounted rate because my boss is RTPI but the cost is still eyewatering enough that we only call on them in extreme cases.

General public I was on about George not professionals.