New Holland dynamic command

[michael N123]

the quality of gear changes and shuttle change is not good enough for a modern tractor and the whine and noise coming from them are not good either. weve had 5 wont have another with that gear box

It’s that bad you’ve bought 5

 

[nelson]

It’s that bad you’ve bought 5

thats over the last 25 years we still have the 1st one which for 25 years has been very good and the others have been ok but the new one we had 6 years ago is shocking '! time to move on for us

 

[Wreckit Ralf]

Electro Command isn't being replaced. It will still be available, probably as the 'standard' gearbox in a T6, with Dynamic Command an option along side the Vario. So I've been informed anyway.

 

[Boohoo]

Anyone complaining about electro command should try dual or shuttle command for a day. Hopefully dynamic command or something similar will be offered on the T7s soon because range and power command are long overdue an update.

 

[holywell farmer]

Electro Command isn't being replaced. It will still be available, probably as the 'standard' gearbox in a T6, with Dynamic Command an option along side the Vario. So I've been informed anyway.

Seems tractor manufacturers are going with more changes on the move John Deere stuck with power quad for years but direct drive seems to be way forward, Massey ferguson dyna 6 on this forum gets a lot of stick for some reason ?

 

[Cowabunga]

Don't think they made them, just bought them in, think they were a Funk box. My only experience of a full powershift was a MF8240, personally I'd prefer a dynashift.

The issue with sequential full powershift gearboxes is that you can't easily skip gears but have to sequence through a whole lot of ratios. The more gears a semi-powershift has, whatever the type, the more like a full powershift it becomes. Personally I think six steps is about right, so the driver can skip up to four or five at a time when its convenient to do so. Four speeds are too few for me, resulting in too many range changes. Nine, which I have on one tractor, is often too many.

I remain to be convinced by twin clutch transmissions. No doubt they work very well when new, but my concern is that they have a box-full of wearing parts that are almost constantly forcibly shifted, which are selectors and synchromesh units. These are shifting in anticipation of the next change being up or down, an amazing number of times without the engaged ratio necessarily changing at all. I defy anyone to claim that these things are not more wear-prone than a conventional planetary of constant mesh powershift. They are faster to change though, simply because they pre-engage the next ratio before the clutch packs change the drive path.

 

[holywell farmer]

The issue with sequential full powershift gearboxes is that you can't easily skip gears but have to sequence through a whole lot of ratios. The more gears a semi-powershift has, whatever the type, the more like a full powershift it becomes. Personally I think six steps is about right, so the driver can skip up to four or five at a time when its convenient to do so. Four speeds are too few for me, resulting in too many range changes. Nine, which I have on one tractor, is often too many.

I remain to be convinced by twin clutch transmissions. No doubt they work very well when new, but my concern is that they have a box-full of wearing parts that are almost constantly forcibly shifted, which are selectors and synchromesh units. These are shifting in anticipation of the next change being up or down, an amazing number of times without the engaged ratio necessarily changing at all. I defy anyone to claim that these things are not more wear-prone than a conventional planetary of constant mesh powershift. They are faster to change though, simply because they pre-engage the next ratio before the clutch packs change the drive path.

It's like Massey got dynashift 32-32 down fine art that gear box

 

[Cowabunga]

Seems tractor manufacturers are going with more changes on the move John Deere stuck with power quad for years but direct drive seems to be way forward, Massey ferguson dyna 6 on this forum gets a lot of stick for some reason ?

Mostly because they designed it to be complex for a driver to set up and to maintain that setting. There were initially some peculiar delays changing ratios, which I presume has been sorted over the years with software updates.

 

[holywell farmer]

Mostly because they designed it to be complex for a driver to set up and to maintain that setting. There were initially some peculiar delays changing ratios, which I presume has been sorted over the years with software updates.

Both my uncle 5480 and 5460 has dyna 4 simple to use is the word !

 

[Cowabunga]

It's like Massey got dynashift 32-32 down fine art that gear box

The close and overlapping ratios of that box still has a lot of fans. Initially it was thought that perhaps they would keep the Dynashift to complement the Dyna6, but the production line does not lend itself to building two such different gearboxes. Dynashift production ended before D4 and D6 started.

 

[Cowabunga]

Both my uncle 5480 and 5460 has dyna 4 simple to use is the word !

Yes I agree with you and its a big favourite on my farm, precisely because it is simple with no nonsense. You just cannot say the same for the Dyna6 with auto drive, which I happen to like for its customisation options, but which many people just don't like or understand.

 

[holywell farmer]

Yes I agree with you and its a big favourite on my farm, precisely because it is simple with no nonsense. You just cannot say the same for the Dyna6 with auto drive, which I happen to like for its customisation options, but which many people just don't like or understand.

Well I love to get chance to drive a new Holland dynamic command tractor sounds gear box packed with technology

 

[Cowabunga]

Well I love to get chance to drive a new Holland dynamic command tractor sounds gear box packed with technology

The gearbox itself is a new design for NH but the technology is as old as the ark. Its just a synchromesh mechanical transmission with rams working the selectors. What's relatively new for tractors is the two shaft design with a pack on each. The software is what makes these transmissions work and do their business. Without the trick software it would have to have levers into the cab and a direct link from the clutch to a foot pedal.

 

[cosmagedon]

The issue with sequential full powershift gearboxes is that you can't easily skip gears but have to sequence through a whole lot of ratios. The more gears a semi-powershift has, whatever the type, the more like a full powershift it becomes. Personally I think six steps is about right, so the driver can skip up to four or five at a time when its convenient to do so. Four speeds are too few for me, resulting in too many range changes. Nine, which I have on one tractor, is often too many.

I remain to be convinced by twin clutch transmissions. No doubt they work very well when new, but my concern is that they have a box-full of wearing parts that are almost constantly forcibly shifted, which are selectors and synchromesh units. These are shifting in anticipation of the next change being up or down, an amazing number of times without the engaged ratio necessarily changing at all. I defy anyone to claim that these things are not more wear-prone than a conventional planetary of constant mesh powershift. They are faster to change though, simply because they pre-engage the next ratio before the clutch packs change the drive path.

I think the saving grace of a twin clutch being it never has to shift under load, the mechanical side is already selected and the clutch pack takes the grunt. The software will make or break it though.

 

[Cowabunga]

I think the saving grace of a twin clutch being it never has to shift under load, the mechanical side is already selected and the clutch pack takes the grunt. The software will make or break it though.

That is the case with any gearbox, mechanical or semi-powershift or full powershift. The strain is always on the clutch as far as torque goes. Synchromesh is always prone to wear though, especially by abusive rough drivers of manual boxes and through the shear aggressive ultra-fast shifting of the robotised selectors ramming it from one ratio to another. There's no modulation of the synchro change as there is for the clutches swapping over.

I've no idea how long the service life of these synchro units in the dual clutch gearboxes will be. I do know that they will surely not last as long as a well driven manual box and probably not as long as a good conventional powershift. When faults occur on CNH Range Command or Power Command or a MFD6, likely as not it will be the synchronisers in the range change that will fail first and these units do not change anything like as often as a dual clutch unit.
Time will tell. How are the JD Direct Drive units doing? Are they mostly trouble free so far?

 

[jamesy]

Well, call me old fashioned but I like electro command just fine!

Does all I need it to.

 

[oil barron]

That is the case with any gearbox, mechanical or semi-powershift or full powershift. The strain is always on the clutch as far as torque goes. Synchromesh is always prone to wear though, especially by abusive rough drivers of manual boxes and through the shear aggressive ultra-fast shifting of the robotised selectors ramming it from one ratio to another. There's no modulation of the synchro change as there is for the clutches swapping over.

I've no idea how long the service life of these synchro units in the dual clutch gearboxes will be. I do know that they will surely not last as long as a well driven manual box and probably not as long as a good conventional powershift. When faults occur on CNH Range Command or Power Command or a MFD6, likely as not it will be the synchronisers in the range change that will fail first and these units do not change anything like as often as a dual clutch unit.
Time will tell. How are the JD Direct Drive units doing? Are they mostly trouble free so far?

A dual clutch transmission will be easier on the syndros than a robotized range change on a semi power shift because the output shaft is not spinning When the gear is selected. They would almost work as constant mesh gearbox’s without syncros.

 

[Cowabunga]

A dual clutch transmission will be easier on the syndros than a robotized range change on a semi power shift because the output shaft is not spinning When the gear is selected. They would almost work as constant mesh gearbox’s without syncros.

I presume you mean when the tractor is at a standstill in the case of a constant mesh 'crash' box?

I'm not so sure about your suggested mode of operation. This video shows both shafts spinning whichever clutch is engaged. I've not seen one cut away in the metal yet though. I have no doubt that the robotised change is brutal and almost instant even if the shafts being connected are in fact turning at the same speed. If they are, there would surely be no need for synchros, as dogs would work just as well.

 

[Pheasant Surprise]

They’re not so crash hot in the car world. Dry clutch contamination issues and crap ECU soldering at fault with the so called “PowerShift” dual clutch units fitted by Fix Or Repair Daily. The ACCC (local competition watchdog) ended up suing Ford Australia over it.

Dual clutch transmission, especially from Ford, is pretty much a swear word here in oz.

Here’s your favourite gobby mate off on one again @Cowabunga

 

[Tarw Coch]

Yes I agree with you and its a big favourite on my farm, precisely because it is simple with no nonsense. You just cannot say the same for the Dyna6 with auto drive, which I happen to like for its customisation options, but which many people just don't like or understand.

Simple and no nonsense certainly aren't words I'd use to describe dyna4, I seem to have to study the handbook in complete frustration every time I drive mine. It's certainly not what I wanted of a tractor, something that any reasonably experienced driver could jump on and operate without the need for specific instruction and certainly not the need to refer to the instruction manual.

I'm sure it would be fine for a one driver tractor once they've mastered the technicalities of the gearbox but simple and no nonsense it's not, I am left wondering if there could possibly be different versions of dyna4, is there a simple no nonsense version and one full of electro bollox?