Solar Farm letters

[Still Farming]

The main issue is the company owning the solar are not he same as the main contractor - these people used a company and they did everything on the cheap. Fencing not completed to our standards, dreadfully dug drainage ditches, Didnt agree access coded gate. Gates between fields not installed. Reinstatement not great. Hedgeplanting poor and not maintained (it is being actioned now). Rubbish and plastic left in ground.

One of the issues is the size of the field and too big for a flock of sheep - obv you cant split them. Gathering sheep is not easy a lot of banging heads! Maintaining the grounds is also not easy and the grass isnt the best - it needs a fresh lay in some.

Its a bit of a change in lifestyle to have contractors turning up - things like access when youve just blocked off the yard when managing the cows. There are advantages of having people around as in stock control (they usually report a sick sheep) plus the advantage of security.

Its a fact that we did chose rightly, the option came about and there was no other options available, this financially is a winner as no inputs. It does take out options of fields though and rotation is much more difficult. Def dont regret it.

Look like business Partnership between different companies is it?
Nothing seem straight forward is it??

 

[steveR]

One of the issues is the size of the field and too big for a flock of sheep - obv you cant split them. Gathering sheep is not easy a lot of banging heads! Maintaining the grounds is also not easy and the grass isnt the best - it needs a fresh lay in some.

Its a fact that we did chose rightly, the option came about and there was no other options available, this financially is a winner as no inputs. It does take out options of fields though and rotation is much more difficult. Def dont regret it.

Just read this....

Are you not allowed to use an electric fence internally?

I am fortunate in that the solar farm here is 20 ac and split 8 and 12ac, and the smaller area is hedged and fenced and with 3 gateways internally. I run the sheep into the smaller block and they then run to the far end where there is another opening back to the larger block.... And a large holding pen!! I leave Herself hiding behind teh hedge and she quickly closes the gate on the sheep!

However, one of the guts from Vogy (who built the site) knew of a farmer who was managing sheep in a big site with electric fences. I asked whether there were any potential dangers, and he assured me no...

 

[steveR]

On the other hand you will own a solar park, which with a bit of maintenance will still be generating electricity. I can't see that extending the planning will be difficult. Or it is brown field development. Or you might be able to extend the lease. In many of our cases it will be the kids problem anyway!!

Hopefully, ours will be an income stream well into our dotage, possibly with ownership in the family by then...

 

[Doing it for the kids]

If anyone can get solar on their land, take it with both hands, unless you think you can get commercial or residential in the very near future, or you have plenty of quarterly income!

 

[snarling bee]

IME all extra income from our property assets is never hassle free, Why would it be?
Just do the cost/benefit analysis, but assume the hassle is 3x what you initially expect.

 

[snarling bee]

If anyone can get solar on their land, take it with both hands, unless you think you can get commercial or residential in the very near future, or you have plenty of quarterly income!

There are plenty round here who have turned down solar development because of the chance of bricks and mortar. It will probably take them until the end of a solar lease to get the permanent development, in which case they would have got a brownfield site anyway.

 

[Surgery]

Had meetings etc over 100 acre site , ball park 1k an acre but would be slightly more , all sounds dandy.

but then.....

non ag use so all tax complications.

What will the equipment be worth at end of term , will it be fooked and cost to improve or dismantle , a question I asked the rep to which he said he has never been asked before.

No end of other complications if I snuff it re Ag relief.

As I see it , and please do t think I’m-turning my nose up to a lot of money , but I just don’t think it’s worth it in the long run , it needs to pay a lot more imo.

 

[Still Farming]

If anyone can get solar on their land, take it with both hands, unless you think you can get commercial or residential in the very near future, or you have plenty of quarterly income!

What is certainty like as years ago firms would start up build sites ,then other partnerships forms,then go bang ,then ,bought and sold and assets traded and what ever income landowners got went in solicitors keeping track of it all when in essence the solar park and land went nowhere???

 

[Goweresque]

The full decommissioning cost is caluculated up front using examples from Germany and Spain in particular. It’s then index linked for the duration of the contract and that money is then put into an escrow account held by solicitors. If you don’t get that don’t do the deal.

One has to wonder whether at the end of the lease it will emerge in many cases that this money has mysteriously disappeared. A large pot of money just sat there doing nothing for decades is going to be a honey pot for all manner of shady shenanigans. Especially when the assets are changing hands so regularly. Just because money is supposed to be secure doesn't mean it is. Ask the Maxwell pensioners. And I bet there's a lot less controls in place over what happens to these escrow accounts than there are on pension funds.

 

[snarling bee]

Definitely tax issues!, But will Ag. still have the same reliefs in the future when the tax becomes an issue??
Need to make sure there will be a dismantling bond in place for the end of the lease, if the rep hasn't been asked that before he must be new to the job.
The equipment will still be working at the end of the lease, even if not at peak efficiency, panels degrade at less than 1%p.a.
I'm sure it will be retained as a solar park, whether you own it or the lease is extended. I can't see these solar parks being dismantled and returned to ag, where is the renewable power going to come from?? The worst that can happen is that you get left with a solar park, is that such a bad thing??
I am getting letters every month from investors/agents wanting to buy both the rental income and the freehold. You could capitalise it if you desired. Or give your inheritors the land NOW, whilst it is still agricultural, and let them benefit from the uplift in income and value.

 

[Exfarmer]

Had meetings etc over 100 acre site , ball park 1k an acre but would be slightly more , all sounds dandy.

but then.....

non ag use so all tax complications.

What will the equipment be worth at end of term , will it be fooked and cost to improve or dismantle , a question I asked the rep to which he said he has never been asked before.

No end of other complications if I snuff it re Ag relief.

As I see it , and please do t think I’m-turning my nose up to a lot of money , but I just don’t think it’s worth it in the long run , it needs to pay a lot more imo.

If you have had the lease sorted, at the end of it , probably 20 years at hopefully £800 + an acre, you should have a reversion clause, to give all the tenants equipment to the landlord. You should then inherit a solar farm generating about £6,000 an acre at todays prices.. this will probably pay better than farming even then. You may havebto wash it occasionally and change the odd inverter ( most are fully repairable ) but you or your successors will be sitting pretty. The only danger is if you pop your clogs in the meantime, as a landlord to the farm there are no IHT concessiins that I am aware Of. Once the farm reverts if you run it as a business, currently I believe, there are similar concessions to farming businesses

 

[snarling bee]

If you have had the lease sorted, at the end of it , probably 20 years at hopefully £800 + an acre, you should have a reversion clause, to give all the tenants equipment to the landlord. You should then inherit a solar farm generating about £6,000 an acre at todays prices.. this will probably pay better than farming even then. You may havebto wash it occasionally and change the odd inverter ( most are fully repairable ) but you or your successors will be sitting pretty. The only danger is if you pop your clogs in the meantime, as a landlord to the farm there are no IHT concessiins that I am aware Of. Once the farm reverts if you run it as a business, currently I believe, there are similar concessions to farming businesses

I think now developers/investors want between 30 and 40 year leases for solar.

For the OP - Its all up for negotiation. See how far you can push; they all have initial offers and then a bottom line below which they will not drop.

 

[Still Farming]

But will they be classed as "brown field" sites then and easier for industrial or housing uses???

 

[Exfarmer]

But will they be classed as "brown field" sites then and easier for industrial or housing uses???

Will we be buildingnew houses in 20+ years, who knows

 

[steveR]

I think now developers/investors want between 30 and 40 year leases for solar.

For the OP - Its all up for negotiation. See how far you can push; they all have initial offers and then a bottom line below which they will not drop.

Correct on that extended period now. I had one outfit wanting 120ac, 40 years lease as we have the connection available, on farm in effect. I said no.

If we had more land, I might have bit...

 

[Steevo]

One has to wonder whether at the end of the lease it will emerge in many cases that this money has mysteriously disappeared. A large pot of money just sat there doing nothing for decades is going to be a honey pot for all manner of shady shenanigans. Especially when the assets are changing hands so regularly. Just because money is supposed to be secure doesn't mean it is. Ask the Maxwell pensioners. And I bet there's a lot less controls in place over what happens to these escrow accounts than there are on pension funds.

Dismantling bond doesn’t start being created til the last 5 years or so. It’s not sat there for decades.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

But will they be classed as "brown field" sites then and easier for industrial or housing uses???

who knows, 20+ yrs is a long way off, they may have been encapsulated by perimeter development so ready for infill.

Dismantling bond doesn’t start being created til the last 5 years or so. It’s not sat there for decades.

that entirely depends on the contract! Sounds pretty risky to consider that, normally they insure for the first few years and then build up a sinking fund and reduce the insurance to that affect.

 

[Goweresque]

Dismantling bond doesn’t start being created til the last 5 years or so. It’s not sat there for decades.

Thats even worse, what happens if the operator goes bust within the last 5 years of the lease, and no-one can be found to take it on, and make the remaining dismantling payments? The farmer is left with the assets, yes, but also no dismantling fund, so has all the liabilities as well.

Given the number of slippery and downright fraudulent operators who infest the renewables industry its got to be odds on that some farmers will be left holding the can for the dismantling of these solar parks because of sharp practice or actual criminal behaviour.

 

[MrNoo]

Am sure the local Transit Van mob would have it done away with in a couple of weeks. But as an aside, quite a few tons of steel, alloy, copper etc involved. I also thought that they are recycling panels now.
I will double check the bond status on ours, pretty sure it has to be in place pre operation.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

Am sure the local Transit Van mob would have it done away with in a couple of weeks. But as an aside, quite a few tons of steel, alloy, copper etc involved. I also thought that they are recycling panels now.
I will double check the bond status on ours, pretty sure it has to be in place pre operation.

if its not id give your agent a kick! I would be amazed if anyone signs up to these things without that in place.

they are recycling panels, I believe some of the earlier solar farms are already having their panels upgraded, so long as the grid can take the extra export.