What if Russia targets a NATO member state?

[Danllan]

I think it very unlikely, but let's assume that for whatever reason, and without any prior Polish hostile actions, Putin decides to bomb or shell a Polish road, bridge, checkpoint, farm, village, airfield or what have you, and it leads to fatalities. Is there anyone who'll argue that we - the UK - should do nothing in such a scenario?


Asking because I have been surprised by the reaction of some against our helping Ukraine, even only as we have said.

 

[neilo]

Isn’t that the whole principle on which NATO was founded? An attack on one is an attack on all.

 

[teslacoils]

Yes. Because that's what everyone in NATO has signed up for.

 

[ollie989898]

If the Russians do something like this they will probably blame it on 'pro-Russian elements in the Ukraine'. Just the same as what they did in Syria at the Battle of Khasham. In response, the US put down some steel rain and sorted it. The same will happen here. The sky is already loaded with drones, surveillance and ELINT aircraft, so they will know where the Russian troop and vehicle concentrations are.

 

[Treg]

Testing the water with Ukraine.

 

[teslacoils]

Testing the water with Ukraine.

Ukraine is not in NATO. Tbh, if they ruled out joining they may find themselves in a better position. If they tried to get in to NATO in a hurry, the russian tanks would be in Kiev before the lid of the signing pen was opened.

 

[7610 super q]

I think we should lie low. Very low. We don't have the equipment, nor resources to do much of anything ATM. This isn't 1940, where everyone would mobilise for the common good. Folks these days will be furloughing, and going to Adele gigs instead.
Let someone else do it for once. If Putin invaded Skegness, who would help us ? Certainly not the fudging French and Germans. Nor Biden I don't think.
We should be more like Portugal, and do fudge all to help police the world. Hasn't done them any harm........

 

[Danllan]

Isn’t that the whole principle on which NATO was founded? An attack on one is an attack on all.

Quite right, but what with the current words from some, it does make one wonder...

 

[teslacoils]

Portugal provided support under NATO to Afghanistan and Bosnia. Maybe more in other former Yugoslavia.

 

[hoff135]

Answered yes. But if he did start on a nato member he is a lunatic, so far I've not seen anything to make me think he is.

I don't think that will happen. Also it seems the west is creating an hysteria which I don't think is helping.

 

[betweenthelines]

Why would he?

He has the West where he wants due to our reliance on the oil and gas he controls.

 

[hoff135]

Why would he?

He has the West where he wants due to our reliance on the oil and gas he controls.

There's nothing to be gained from a nuclear exchange between nato and Russia. Both sides know that if they attack the other they risk being destroyed themselves. Probably why we have had relative peace since ww2. I think if there was no such thing as the nuclear bomb the west and Russia would have had a conventional war long ago

 

[neilo]

Why would he?

He has the West where he wants due to our reliance on the oil and gas he controls.

If nothing else, the unfolding situation will at least serve as a wake up call on those policies.

 

[Hfd Cattle]

I think we should lie low. Very low. We don't have the equipment, nor resources to do much of anything ATM. This isn't 1940, where everyone would mobilise for the common good. Folks these days will be furloughing, and going to Adele gigs instead.
Let someone else do it for once. If Putin invaded Skegness, who would help us ? Certainly not the fudging French and Germans. Nor Biden I don't think.
We should be more like Portugal, and do fudge all to help police the world. Hasn't done them any harm........

Surely if Putin invaded Skegness we would thank him wouldn't we ?
Only been there once ...what a cheap dump !

 

[Lowland1]

Surely if Putin invaded Skegness we would thank him wouldn't we ?
Only been there once ...what a cheap dump !

That’s below the belt. Many great holidays were spent on the Lincolnshire riviera it’s a very special place. If Putin invaded Skeg though that would be the end of any expansionism as he would have found paradise. Cheap dump it most certainly isn’t.

 

[DrWazzock]

Poland is non negotiable. You don't make an agreement and reneg on it.
Ukraine, Belarus, etc are a bit different. If those blocs and indeed Russia internally wants change they are going to have to work it through for themselves.
We cannot sort everybody's problems out. We can help where we can be we can't take a lead.
If we go into Ukraine in active combat its the start of WW3, and you'd better be ready for pain the likes of which has not been since WW2. We simply aren't prepared for that and nobody gets a prize for trying and failing in such an undertaking. Go into Ukraine and how far will Russia roll West creating a "buffer zone"? Probably at least as far as the old soviet bloc. maybe further.
The scale of damage and misery has the potential to be immense if we get this wrong and get lured in to Putin's game of chess.
But Poland, and other Nato members, well obviously we have to honour agreements ...... like the last time round.
Hopefully they will get sick of Putin internally before it comes to that.
Sadly though in the meantime he has missiles that go three times the speed of sound with either conventional or nuclear warheads. Even conventionally they could do untold damage. He woudn't have to do much to reduce us to a third world country just by destroying some of our critical infrastructure, undersea cables, gas pipelines etc.
@Danllan Do you seriously think there would be any winners if we engaged Russia in Ukraine? Seriously. I just can't envisage any positive outcome either for ourselves or Ukraine. Russia is a vast country with huge resources and a large military machine. It isn't just going to roll over.

 

[DrWazzock]

Surely if Putin invaded Skegness we would thank him wouldn't we ?
Only been there once ...what a cheap dump !

Now then. Walk along the beach there in the summer and you are as likely to hear Russian as English.

 

[Treg]

Ukraine is not in NATO. Tbh, if they ruled out joining they may find themselves in a better position. If they tried to get in to NATO in a hurry, the russian tanks would be in Kiev before the lid of the signing pen was opened.

I meant Russia are testing with Ukraine, I think wrongly Russia believed the west to be weak and lacked the stomach for a war, the withdrawal from Afghanistan gave this impression & many commentaries at the time said this very thing , but Biden was tied to the withdrawal by the previous administration, I think many Western leaders now believe the withdrawal was a mistake and I think Putin has misjudged the situation.

 

[DrWazzock]

Its a bit like Brexit.
All very well being gung ho.
But lets just think how it might pan out.

 

[Lowland1]

Now then. Walk along the beach there in the summer and you are as likely to hear Russian as English.

Fifth columnists. The bingo halls are full of spies.