Autonomous tractor

[MF 168]

Is a man with 600 cows or 3000 pigs a farmer?

Both are if their farming. If it's a keyboard is doing the work then neither are. Define farming you say, well let me put it this way, you have one of those Lely robots taking care of the foddering, the parlour is automated and fair enough a contractor does the silage but you aren't involved in that so that doesn't count. To be a farmer kinda means your farming and that to me means walking through your livestock, operating machinery, taking soil samples, getting your hands dirty in other words.
We're not going to agree on this topic but I quiet like what I do for a living and I would hate to think that an industry thats almost as old as humanity will one day not require humans to work in. Perhaps I've a rather simplistic view of it.

 

[Clive]

Indeed not, it's those ungrateful so and so's who insist on seeking farm work on this very website. Thirteen out of twenty adverts on the first page of the jobs thread are people actually looking for agricultural employment. Massive shortage? Maybe not.

Having recently tried recruit a skilled arable operator and having plenty of applicants for an attractive well rewarded package on a modern progressive farm I can tell you there is without a shortage of skilled labour

I saw no one I wanted to give a job to really, a couple that “would do” at best

The vacancy has been filled by technology- a bigger strayer and wider drill

 

[Scribus]

Having recently tried recruit a skilled arable operator and having plenty of applicants for an attractive well rewarded package on a modern progressive farm I can tell you there is without a shortage of skilled labour

I saw no one I wanted to give a job to really, a couple that “would do” at best

The vacancy has been filled by technology- a bigger strayer and wider drill

There are some interesting angles to take on that, but it's late, so I'll wonder quietly to myself how many of those you interviewed are asking why there is such a dearth of skilled employers.

 

[kiwi pom]

Having recently tried recruit a skilled arable operator and having plenty of applicants for an attractive well rewarded package on a modern progressive farm I can tell you there is without a shortage of skilled labour

I saw no one I wanted to give a job to really, a couple that “would do” at best

The vacancy has been filled by technology- a bigger strayer and wider drill

Again I'm not sure I agree, I know a lot of skilled operators and they simply don't want to work on a purely combinable cropping farm, there's not enough happening. How many hours a year are your guys actually driving machines?
Its about fit, main jobs for you would be, combining, spraying and pulling a direct drill?
You already have staff for them though so what's a "skilled operator" going to do.
I understand you treat your staff very well and the package is well above average but if you could replace them with a wider drill and sprayer there wasn't much for them to do.
Maybe you just need a keen younger entry level type that you could train up and maybe they would replace a staff member if they leave?

 

[ollie989898]

Again I'm not sure I agree, I know a lot of skilled operators and they simply don't want to work on a purely combinable cropping farm, there's not enough happening. How many hours a year are your guys actually driving machines?
Its about fit, main jobs for you would be, combining, spraying and pulling a direct drill?
You already have staff for them though so what's a "skilled operator" going to do.
I understand you treat your staff very well and the package is well above average but if you could replace them with a wider drill and sprayer there wasn't much for them to do.
Maybe you just need a keen younger entry level type that you could train up and maybe they would replace a staff member if they leave?

This is the point- young people dont seem to want an entry level position nor do they want to remain in the job forever.

LOTS of people are doing multiple degrees or courses as they try to find the career they want. Its common place across many age ranges in the UK.

 

[Vincent]

When its said that no skilled labour can be got, is there no one showing an interest in learning or is it that there is no time to train up an interested person.

 

[db9go]

In answer to Clive when was it easier to get skilled staff
Even 100 years ago they had problems in getting good staff to work with horses
The answer they thought was tractors and machines
and it still goes on and the job still gets done
I have employed a lot of people over the years and the best have come from outside of the many industry that i work in.

 

[Scribus]

Again I'm not sure I agree, I know a lot of skilled operators and they simply don't want to work on a purely combinable cropping farm, there's not enough happening. How many hours a year are your guys actually driving machines?
Its about fit, main jobs for you would be, combining, spraying and pulling a direct drill?
You already have staff for them though so what's a "skilled operator" going to do.
I understand you treat your staff very well and the package is well above average but if you could replace them with a wider drill and sprayer there wasn't much for them to do.
Maybe you just need a keen younger entry level type that you could train up and maybe they would replace a staff member if they leave?

An excellent post, although I might question the emphasis you place on youth being a potential answer. There are plenty of people who would love a mid life career change and they could well bring a whole new perspective to a farming operation. Unfortunately, there is this fixation in farming that only people from an agricultural background are fit to work on farms. Not true, it's very often an excuse not to bother training people.

Mind you, if companies like John Deere are out there trying to convince the world that there are terrible problems with staff procurement that only the purchase of their latest gizmos can solve then it only encourages this closed loop mindset.

 

[Pheasant Surprise]

It’s far, far more difficult to do, even in a well bounded use-case like driving in the road. Tesla and Alphabet (Google) probably leading the pack, each spending oodles of cash and developer time getting it right.

I can tell you it’s still a long way off from universal if my 20,000+ mile of enhanced AP use is anything to go by in mine. It’s definitely bloody good, but it still ghosts every so often. Maybe the new version 3 hardware will have sufficient grunt for the imaging AI engine. I’ll be getting a free upgrade anyway.

Farm use - yeah let’s see what JD brings out. They spent a couple of hundred mill buying Blue River Technology - so they better have something half decent to show for it or Wall Street will savage them @Clive what have they told you?

Just don’t expect full autonomous any time soon. Certainly not from a tractor manufacturer. Just sayin

 

[Scribus]

This is the point- young people dont seem to want an entry level position nor do they want to remain in the job forever.

LOTS of people are doing multiple degrees or courses as they try to find the career they want. Its common place across many age ranges in the UK.

When I were a lad the the system was fairly simple, if you were bright then you were encouraged to go to university and get a profession. If you were considered a thicko then then the factory gate and production line beckoned while those in between were enticed into apprenticeships. It was by no means perfect but it did work on the assumption that jobs were for life and there was some certainty in the future, all that has been swept away so it can hardly be any surprise that young people are confused and concerned about their careers.

 

[Scribus]

It’s far, far more difficult to do, even in a well bounded use-case like driving in the road. Tesla and Alphabet (Google) probably leading the pack, each spending oodles of cash and developer time getting it right.

I can tell you it’s still a long way off from universal if my 20,000+ mile of enhanced AP use is anything to go by in mine. It’s definitely bloody good, but it still ghosts every so often. Maybe the new version 3 hardware will have sufficient grunt for the imaging AI engine. I’ll be getting a free upgrade anyway.

Farm use - yeah let’s see what JD brings out. They spent a couple of hundred mill buying Blue River Technology - so they better have something half decent to show for it or Wall Street will savage them @Clive what have they told you?

Just don’t expect full autonomous any time soon. Certainly not from a tractor manufacturer. Just sayin

AV's are not just about the technology though, there are so many other factors involved in taking responsibility for transit away from the traveler. At it's most basic we become supplicants to both corporations and governments if we wish to travel for both will retain the ability to control and even direct the vehicles, that is NOT progress by any means, but a huge backward step towards serfdom.

But even the technology doesn't work. Just how are AV's to find their way around? Radar is no longer being considered, lidar doesn't work in the rain and cameras relying on huge databases with associated algorithms are fraught with all sorts of difficulties which big tech never anticipated. For instance, Volvo is owned by China, who's to say that Beijing won't threaten to turn Volvo's off if it doesn't get its way?

Besides which there has yet to be shown that anybody outside of the techie bubble actually wants them. We see that with EV's, a massive push with tax breaks and subsidies but few sales. The excuse being that they can't be made fast enough!

 

[Clive]

It’s far, far more difficult to do, even in a well bounded use-case like driving in the road. Tesla and Alphabet (Google) probably leading the pack, each spending oodles of cash and developer time getting it right.

I can tell you it’s still a long way off from universal if my 20,000+ mile of enhanced AP use is anything to go by in mine. It’s definitely bloody good, but it still ghosts every so often. Maybe the new version 3 hardware will have sufficient grunt for the imaging AI engine. I’ll be getting a free upgrade anyway.

Farm use - yeah let’s see what JD brings out. They spent a couple of hundred mill buying Blue River Technology - so they better have something half decent to show for it or Wall Street will savage them @Clive what have they told you?

Just don’t expect full autonomous any time soon. Certainly not from a tractor manufacturer. Just sayin

Can’t say what I saw - had to sign a NDA

But it was rather impressive, not quite replacing the driver just yet though more removing the need for any skill whatsoever

I suspect they will launch it at Agriitechnica

 

[Scribus]

It’s far, far more difficult to do, even in a well bounded use-case like driving in the road. Tesla and Alphabet (Google) probably leading the pack, each spending oodles of cash and developer time getting it right.

I can tell you it’s still a long way off from universal if my 20,000+ mile of enhanced AP use is anything to go by in mine. It’s definitely bloody good, but it still ghosts every so often. Maybe the new version 3 hardware will have sufficient grunt for the imaging AI engine. I’ll be getting a free upgrade anyway.

Farm use - yeah let’s see what JD brings out. They spent a couple of hundred mill buying Blue River Technology - so they better have something half decent to show for it or Wall Street will savage them @Clive what have they told you?

Just don’t expect full autonomous any time soon. Certainly not from a tractor manufacturer. Just sayin

Oh, and the Tesla aupto pilot isn't that good -

Tesla in Autopilot mode crashes into fire truck

https://money.cnn.com/2018/01/23/technology/tesla-fire-truck-crash/index.html

 

[Scribus]

Can’t say what I saw - had to sign a NDA

But it was rather impressive, not quite replacing the driver just yet though more removing the need for any skill whatsoever

I suspect they will launch it ag Agriitechnica

But that's nothing new, Case were saying the exact same thing when they launched their latest combines last year.

 

[Lexion1000]

Haven’t read most of the thread, so point may have been made. But I think automation could be another thing that knackers the farming industry in this country more than helps it. Purely because it will be so much easier to use in the big wide open fields and spaces of USA, Australia Russia etc. In this country there are just too many 5 acre fields, telegraph poles, traffic, crap roads, people everywhere, chemicals banned, regulation etc etc. Automation could drop the cost of production and increase output where it’s easy to use rendering us unviable, to an extent at least anyway.

 

[Clive]

But that's nothing new, Case were saying the exact same thing when they launched their latest combines last year.

This was production ready - its not driverless but is a big step in that direction and way beyond what anyone else has commercially yet

 

[Scribus]

Haven’t read most of the thread, so point may have been made. But I think automation could be another thing that knackers the farming industry in this country more than helps it. Purely because it will be so much easier to use in the big wide open fields and spaces of USA, Australia Russia etc. In this country there are just too many 5 acre fields, telegraph poles, traffic, crap roads, people everywhere, chemicals banned, regulation etc etc. Automation could drop the cost of production and increase output where it’s easy to use rendering us unviable, to an extent at least anyway.

This is very true. Most of the talk of automation originates over in the States where fields are vast and people scarce, a different type of farming altogether.

 

[stevedave]

If you remember a couple of years ago CNH were waxing lyrical about their autonomous tractor. I was talking to a NH employee about this and he was saying how it's very clever and it was going to revolutionise crop production, I then pointed out to him that they couldn't get an icon to point up when the linkage was up and down when it was down, and after 2 or 3 software updates it still wouldn't work properly, so if the tractor didn't know something simple like this then why on earth would I trust it to drive its self. But more to the point it took NH 2 years to sort the icon problem.

 

[Scribus]

This was production ready - its not driverless but is a big step in that direction and way beyond what anyone else has commercially yet

To borrow a phrase.....'They would say that wouldn't they'

The Case 250 series is available for this years harvest with automatic adjustment of the threshing process. Now, JD may have taken the idea further and applied it to other farming operations but it's still not really earth shattering TBH.

 

[Clive]

To borrow a phrase.....'They would say that wouldn't they'

The Case 250 series is available for this years harvest with automatic adjustment of the threshing process. Now, JD may have taken the idea further and applied it to other farming operations but it's still not really earth shattering TBH.

Adjustment to threshing is old tech - class and jd have had that for a few years now. Nothing too clever about that

re the new tech, they didn’t t have to say anything much - I saw it !

I would reserve judgment until you know what it actually is