Lamb cocci advice

[Montexy]

This year instead of buying in stores I took on some cade`s and have been plagued by scours. Weaned at 5 weeks, introduced to grass gradually over the next week then turned them out 24/7. A few of them started getting just a bit loose which I was convinced was just the flush of new grass and the exceptional wet weather but two days later dosed them all with benzimole to sweep up any nemo threat, normally that would be it but things went bad to worse over the two days so got the sick ones in and looking at the sh** convinced myself they have a dose of cocci - never had it on the place before as the stock is normally older or bred on the place. Anyway, got on to the vet who prescribed me Tolracol - drenched them all but the sick ones have not shown any improvement 48 hours later. Three are eating and looking like they will pull through if I can dry them up - one is hardly eating so hydrating, my question here is.... does anyone know when/if I should see an improvement on the sick ones as I've never used Tolracol before.
Thanks all

 

[Cab-over Pete]

We only have a hobby flock, so not the most experience, but we used Tolracol about 3-4 years ago in a similar situation but it didn’t do any good at all.

We’ve used Vecoxan for cocci since then and other stuff like Startect, plus something else the name of which escapes me with good effect.

 

[andybk]

All cocci drenches take a few days to work upto a week , the infective stage can be quite severe , where as wormer is 12-24 hrs or so ,

 

[Montexy]

Thanks for the feedback Andy

 

[neilo]

All cocci drenches take a few days to work upto a week , the infective stage can be quite severe , where as wormer is 12-24 hrs or so ,

Also, if they were scouring badly, their guts may have been damaged beyond repair.
Most will get over it in time, but depends how bad they were before treating.

 

[andybk]

Also, if they were scouring badly, their guts may have been damaged beyond repair.
Most will get over it in time, but depends how bad they were before treating.

one of the three evils , cocci / barbers pole / spring third stage nemo , you dont get much warning and all your hard work can be undone over a weekend

 

[Nithsdale]

I always dose (with Vecoxan) as soon as I see the first lamb scouring - easy to spot as it's down the insides of the back legs, not just around the tail.

24hrs and they are dry.


I fear the OP left it too long and sadly the damage will be done

 

[Old Shep]

Just had it (again) in our pets. It takes a few days for them to pick up, they need lots of clean water to drink with hay and some stock ration to tempt them back into eating. If it's too far gone though you may lose them as eating seems to be painful. Once you've noticed the little painful bleats when they poo if you get it another year (which you could well do) its easier to realise what's going on. Good luck with that worst one

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

Over the last few years we've used Brincombe coxi buckets and found them very effective. They are also very good at controlling orf.

 

[andybk]

Over the last few years we've used Brincombe coxi buckets and found them very effective. They are also very good at controlling orf.

agree but its just cost these days , £30+ bucket + script , worked out £100+ for us for 2 buckets 2 years ago (ok if buying a load) , gone back to vecoxin as you know they been done then even if done twice if i need to keep them in ,
There is a brinicombe cocci non script out with them at present inside a creep area (the imuherb one ) , intake is low (same as script one ) and about third gone and no scouring lambs , but these lambs would have been done at 3 weeks anyway ,so challenge is low so prob ok mopping up odd unresistant lambs , they are on some fairly dirty pasture that i did have a bad problem in last autumn so challenge is there .

 

[R.Dutchman]

I use baycox at about a month here (when they first meet a challenge) that seems to give them the resistance they need. Used to use DB buckets but they didn't build any resistance so had major problems whenever I stopped them.

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

I use baycox at about a month here (when they first meet a challenge) that seems to give them the resistance they need. Used to use DB buckets but they didn't build any resistance so had major problems whenever I stopped them.

That's strange, I though one of the features of using the buckets was that they built up natural resistance quicker

 

[neilo]

I use baycox at about a month here (when they first meet a challenge) that seems to give them the resistance they need. Used to use DB buckets but they didn't build any resistance so had major problems whenever I stopped them.

I’ve never found that with the DB buckets. The lambs never seem to bother with them until they are challenged, then the high Deccox content cleans them out quickly, with the challenge having built immunity.

We used to have the problem years ago, when we used to give a ‘feed block’ (or creep) with a low level of Deccox, where the continual, steady intake used to prevent any challenge in the first place.

 

[Longlowdog]

Some years back I lost a big percentage of my lambs to a nemo-cocci storm, however once diagnosed and treated the remainder did make a recovery and go on to thrive. I wouldn't give up hope yet but the wormer is basically a one day clean out. You may need to repeat it if there has been a nemo flush such as happens after ten-ish warm days following a cold spell. I wormed three weeks ago when my lambs got a wee touch of scours, it cleared up then went hellish cold and wet, I will be keeping a very close eye on them now that we have a real warm spell forecast for a while.
Google 'scops nematodiris forecast' for your area and see what risk zone you are in.

 

[Estate fencing.]

I’ve never found that with the DB buckets. The lambs never seem to bother with them until they are challenged, then the high Deccox content cleans them out quickly, with the challenge having built immunity.

We used to have the problem years ago, when we used to give a ‘feed block’ (or creep) with a low level of Deccox, where the continual, steady intake used to prevent any challenge in the first place.

I use dB buckets on park land that I used to have terrible trouble with cocci. Did an egg count with the vet couple of years a go and they did cocci as well, vet rang up in a panic because they had a enormous about of coco and they should be dieing, but the lambs where really thriving so much have built up an immunity to cocci.

 

[Woolless]

I use dB buckets on park land that I used to have terrible trouble with cocci. Did an egg count with the vet couple of years a go and they did cocci as well, vet rang up in a panic because they had a enormous about of coco and they should be dieing, but the lambs where really thriving so much have built up an immunity to cocci.

It could be that those fields harboured a non-pathogenic strain of cocci. In early FECs, I often have a lot of cocci eggs but the lambs seem ok. New development this year in that the cocci was affecting them.

 

[neilo]

I use dB buckets on park land that I used to have terrible trouble with cocci. Did an egg count with the vet couple of years a go and they did cocci as well, vet rang up in a panic because they had a enormous about of coco and they should be dieing, but the lambs where really thriving so much have built up an immunity to cocci.

I’m pretty sure they reduce challenge over time too. As lambs never get to the point where they are pumping out zillions of eggs, the pasture loading will reduce over successive years.

No proof of that, but we certainly see less of a challenge now than we used to, despite being sheep only.

 

[R.Dutchman]

Mine were on a new block of land and were dropping dead before they took on any kind of block or creep (about 3 weeks) haven't been brave enough to change policy yet!

 

[Montexy]

Some years back I lost a big percentage of my lambs to a nemo-cocci storm, however once diagnosed and treated the remainder did make a recovery and go on to thrive. I wouldn't give up hope yet but the wormer is basically a one day clean out. You may need to repeat it if there has been a nemo flush such as happens after ten-ish warm days following a cold spell. I wormed three weeks ago when my lambs got a wee touch of scours, it cleared up then went hellish cold and wet, I will be keeping a very close eye on them now that we have a real warm spell forecast for a while.
Google 'scops nematodiris forecast' for your area and see what risk zone you are in.

Well looks like the Tolracol kicked in yesterday as one firmed up and this morning two more were firm, the forth one less runny & appetite has picked up so fingers crossed it looks like I might just have caught it although I know there will be a lot of gut damage. The Nemo side of it is never a problem as I keep on top of that - it was me thinking I had a Nemo storm and not realising they had cocci that was the problem and that lost me a couple of days - we`ve never had it in any of the sheep before as the bought in stores were older they have more immunity and when we used to lamb our own with a long weaning period the grass intake was low, I think trying cades this year and weaning so early means their grass uptake is very high at a young age and so they are more at risk. Hope your lot stay ok & thanks for your reply