Shepherding cost?

[Hilly]

As others have said, I'd go with an hourly rate from the minute you leave to the minute you get home that way everyone knows where they stand. Set pricing or anything like that and you're rolling the dice. Plus you said they've got the money so won't mind paying a fair rate.

Rates in ag are so unbelievably poor, its almost embarrassing. In my day job I charge myself out at £65/hour+VAT, yet in ag people start squealing if its over £15 for a skilled job using their own kit and trained dogs etc, then they wonder why people don't want to do it.

Whats your day job ?

 

[gwi1890]

Problem is employers would rather employe 2 or 3 lads/girls at £10per hour than a good shepherd at £20-£25 an hour, I had a client who thought I was expensive but every time he wanted it o gather , inject , drench, pick lambs and someone with a trailer license and could actually set up the pratley the phone rang .

 

[toquark]

Whats your day job ?

Rocket scientist

 

[unlacedgecko]

Rocket scientist

I'm sure you're very clever. But it's not exactly brain surgery is it?

 

[CopperBeech]

I agree with regard to the fact that really an experienced, real good shepherd should be more than £15 an hour. The problem is there are an awful lot of not very good shepherds about. Also people always say about other trades earning more per hour. But it is unusual that many other trades get paid to drive about smoking fags, eating haribo and looking out the window, broken up with the occasional / frequent chinwag out of the motor window.

I do get it I really do. But it just amazes me what some folk think they are worth, and what some folk think others are worth.

Another favourite is “if you want my dogs I’ve got to charge £20/£25”....... well how does it work if your dogs stay in the motor and I get the sheep in with mine because yours are a pain in the hole..... do I get a discount ? You’re not a shepherd without a dog, and you’re only half a shepherd with a not very good dog.

Had to gather 700 ewes with lambs at foot spread across 400 acres of trees, ditches, small rough fields and cover today, in the baking heat, with only a young lad to help (he brought up the rear), today the two dogs earned their keep!

On a side note I always think ..... the day someone goes round my sheep when I’m away and I come back and they have not missed anything that I spot and achieved all that was asked...... they can ask what they like. But it ain’t happened yet!

I have a list of a few shepherds who I would leave my flock with for a couple months and let them make the management decisions and not worry. And it’s a lot lot shorter than the list of shepherds I know!

 

[The law of sod]

I agree with regard to the fact that really an experienced, real good shepherd should be more than £15 an hour. The problem is there are an awful lot of not very good shepherds about. Also people always say about other trades earning more per hour. But it is unusual that many other trades get paid to drive about smoking fags, eating haribo and looking out the window, broken up with the occasional / frequent chinwag out of the motor window.

I do get it I really do. But it just amazes me what some folk think they are worth, and what some folk think others are worth.

Another favourite is “if you want my dogs I’ve got to charge £20/£25”....... well how does it work if your dogs stay in the motor and I get the sheep in with mine because yours are a pain in the hole..... do I get a discount ? You’re not a shepherd without a dog, and you’re only half a shepherd with a not very good dog.

Had to gather 700 ewes with lambs at foot spread across 400 acres of trees, ditches, small rough fields and cover today, in the baking heat, with only a young lad to help (he brought up the rear), today the two dogs earned their keep!

On a side note I always think ..... the day someone goes round my sheep when I’m away and I come back and they have not missed anything that I spot and achieved all that was asked...... they can ask what they like. But it ain’t happened yet!

I have a list of a few shepherds who I would leave my flock with for a couple months and let them make the management decisions and not worry. And it’s a lot lot shorter than the list of shepherds I know!

I still dont get how anybody who self employed working in any industry ,45 hours a week,(not inc all extra hidden hours you do, paper work ,ordering materials /consumables etc.)
can work for less than £25 an hour ,
And
still leave some profit to invest at the end of the year,
might aswell go and be employed for someone,
Unless work 60-70 hour weeks
Which isnt no good in long term,get to late 40’s and you start to feel it

 

[CopperBeech]

I still dont get how anybody who self employed working in any industry ,45 hours a week,(not inc all extra hidden hours you do, paper work ,ordering materials /consumables etc.)
can work for less than £25 an hour ,
And
still leave some profit to invest at the end of the year,
might aswell go and be employed for someone,
Unless work 60-70 hour weeks
Which isnt no good in long term,get to late 40’s and you start to feel it

That’s great. And I wouldn’t object to lying that but the person would have to be incredibly efficient, very very through, and make me good money. Anything less than gold standard and it would be bye bye!

 

[Estate fencing.]

Think I will stick to my £12/hour slap dash stile off work thanks.

 

[CopperBeech]

Two of my favourite lines are -

“ I could earn more labouring on a building site”

....... really ? Then why aren’t you ?

“I don’t get out of bed for less than £25 an hour”

Is that why you spend a lot of time in bed and don’t get bugger all work then ?

 

[gwi1890]

I still dont get how anybody who self employed working in any industry ,45 hours a week,(not inc all extra hidden hours you do, paper work ,ordering materials /consumables etc.)
can work for less than £25 an hour ,
And
still leave some profit to invest at the end of the year,
might aswell go and be employed for someone,
Unless work 60-70 hour weeks
Which isnt no good in long term,get to late 40’s and you start to feel it

you'd be surprised how many do, a friend of mine literally runs his employers contracting business, it’s his job at night to organise where his team goes the next morning , he has a hgv license , digger ticket, dumpers the lot, can turn his hand to most things, but doesn’t earn much over the minimum wage.

 

[CopperBeech]

To put this in context we are talking about a self employed shepherd making £60k a year for 45 hours a week

 

[unlacedgecko]

you'd be surprised how many do, a friend of mine literally runs his employers contracting business, it’s his job at night to organise where his team goes the next morning , he has a hgv license , digger ticket, dumpers the lot, can turn his hand to most things, but doesn’t earn much over the minimum wage.

Until people start to recognise their own worth, and begin demanding it, employers will continue to take the pee.

When I go contract shepherding I charge £250+VAT per day. And I get fed. And accommodation if it's more than one day.

Not many people want me with those terms and conditions. That's fine, I'm not looking to buy work. Fortunately I have plenty of work avail outside ag which pays very well.

I have my own sheep to run badly and lose money on. I'm not going to lose more money working for someone else.

 

[Estate fencing.]

You would struggle to find someone to keep sheep up the race let alone do the job themselves round here. Most good lads go on the shearing circuit until they are warn out.

 

[CopperBeech]

S

Until people start to recognise their own worth, and begin demanding it, employers will continue to take the pee.

When I go contract shepherding I charge £250+VAT per day. And I get fed. And accommodation if it's more than one day.

Not many people want me with those terms and conditions. That's fine, I'm not looking to buy work. Fortunately I have plenty of work avail outside ag which pays very well.

I have my own sheep to run badly and lose money on. I'm not going to lose more money working for someone else.

See when I go contract shepherding I seem to end up feeding the person I’m working for

 

[The law of sod]

Ag rates seem too low compared to another industry that has similar level of skill
,certain areas of the construction industry,

seems to be a mindset of low pay and work the hours to earn the good money,i guess the “love of it” keeps pay low ,along
With the low returns
,it going take one hell of a shift in the industry to bring the pay up,
Not knocking it but i don’t understand it personally,
I only work for the money,
And spend spare time looking after the sheep,
Maybe it should be other way round?
Work doing something you enjoy and what you spend your time working for ,just so you can do it in your spare time

 

[The law of sod]

To put this in context we are talking about a self employed shepherd making £60k a year for 45 hours a week

But how many ewes could you look after doing 45 hours a week,fair few thousand

 

[Hilly]

Until people start to recognise their own worth, and begin demanding it, employers will continue to take the pee.

When I go contract shepherding I charge £250+VAT per day. And I get fed. And accommodation if it's more than one day.

Not many people want me with those terms and conditions. That's fine, I'm not looking to buy work. Fortunately I have plenty of work avail outside ag which pays very well.

I have my own sheep to run badly and lose money on. I'm not going to lose more money working for someone else.

Im sure plenty would love to employ you for £250 a day etc but it just dosent work ££££ and its a very low skilled job , the kids can donthe sheep work ar the weekend . Ive currently got s lad working with me on£25 hr but he can do things not many can . Anyone interested in sheep can do sheep work .

 

[The law of sod]

Im sure plenty would love to employ you for £250 a day etc but it just dosent work ££££ and its a very low skilled job , the kids can donthe sheep work ar the weekend . Ive currently got s lad working with me on£25 hr but he can do things not many can . Anyone interested in sheep can do sheep work .

Sheep low skilled job when actually doing the work,can pick it up after a few goes ,

but
gathering in, picking up on issues, sorting those issues,
Planning the future for the flock etc
and doing all the above speedily ,
I dont think they should be on anything less than £25 an hour,

 

[CopperBeech]

That depends on a lot of things!

But how many ewes could you look after doing 45 hours a week,fair few thousand

But agreed, it’s more about the number of ewes I guess.

It’s probably also important to note there is a difference between someone who checks your sheep or pushes them up a race and someone who manages your sheep and gets the best out of them.

 

[The law of sod]

The last part is who i think should at least be on 25hour