Time for the next step against RT/NFU?

[SilliamWhale]

I have to keep a record of all sprays used dates, time, weather, rates. The crop is constantly monitored before cropping, after cropping and in the market, if a residue is found before cropping I throw the crop away, if it is found in the market I pay the recall. It is far more than a simple self declaration.

Do you do all this for free?

 

[stewart]

If and of course it's a big if farmers refuse to supply their produce the supermarkets will back down very quickly, they wont want customers breaking down their doors to try and find food, as we have seen this week that the government will soon step in if good supplies are threatened, they just have to believe we are serious,now that's where the problem starts.
You say the markets require strict quality assurance we know for grain imports that is simply not true, all they supply is a simple declaration, which of course is complete rubbish

Are you talking about grain ? Did I use the word rubbish ?

No and Yes

 

[tullah]

I have to keep a record of all sprays used dates, time, weather, rates. The crop is constantly monitored before cropping, after cropping and in the market, if a residue is found before cropping I throw the crop away, if it is found in the market I pay the recall. It is far more than a simple self declaration.

As you say it's just a piece of paper with some records written on it. Anybody can write up these so called records given the time. Nothing proves you have complied with the nonsense of RT though does it

 

[stewart]

Do you do all this for free?

Well I don't get paid directly for it although it does give us access to the markets, so worth doing if I want to carry on in business.

 

[Grass And Grain]

Each area has a grower number attached to it with a suffix for the block, this number is printed on the side of the box when packed, in the event of a problem in the market, this number can be used to trace the product right back to the area it was produced, this is also used to gain data on keeping quality. How do you track yours.

The imports get blended from different farms at a grain elevator, then blended again at the docks.

Then those non-assured imports get compounded with our UK assured grain into the same end product.

Again, this is why we say it's a complete nonsense.

 

[stewart]

As you say it's just a piece of paper with some records written on it. Anybody can write up these so called records given the time. Nothing proves you have complied with the nonsense of RT though does it

You may not have read my post entirely. Did I say it was just a piece of paper? It is far more than that, residue testing ensures what I declare on the paper is fact (it's actually electronic not paper but that is incidental).

 

[stewart]

The imports get blended from different farms at a grain elevator, then blended again at the docks.

Then those non-assured imports get compounded with our UK assured grain into the same end product.

Again, this is why we say it's a complete nonsense.

Would they get tested prior to being delivered to the elevator? And tested again at the elevator?

 

[robs1]

No and Yes

So you dont know what the declaration says then, many chems are allowed abroad that arent here, it's impossible to test a boat load properly so it's impossible to tell if banned chems have been used therefore a declaration is complete rubbish.therefore imported grain is not to the same standard as uk produced grain, horsegate proved beyond doubt you cant trace meat properly let alone thousands of tonnes of grain in a boat. Not sure why you are even interested in the RT debate it diesnt affect you

 

[SilliamWhale]

Well I don't get paid directly for it although it does give us access to the markets, so worth doing if I want to carry on in business.

If another product came in to compete with you how would you feel if they didn't have to do anything like what you do to access the market? ie they just sold the product on merit without the assurance?

Would you think its absolutely fine or would you find it unfair?

 

[SilliamWhale]

Would they get tested prior to being delivered to the elevator? And tested again at the elevator?

No one is able to tell you that!

 

[stewart]

If another product came in to compete with you how would you feel if they didn't have to do anything like what you do to access the market? ie they just sold the product on merit without the assurance?

Would you think its absolutely fine or would you find it unfair?

I would not be too happy about it, although I would not assume it does not meet the same standards of assurance, have you been to see what the other producers have to go through to have access to your market?

 

[stewart]

No one is able to tell you that!

They should be able to.

 

[stewart]

So you dont know what the declaration says then, many chems are allowed abroad that arent here, it's impossible to test a boat load properly so it's impossible to tell if banned chems have been used therefore a declaration is complete rubbish.therefore imported grain is not to the same standard as uk produced grain, horsegate proved beyond doubt you cant trace meat properly let alone thousands of tonnes of grain in a boat. Not sure why you are even interested in the RT debate it diesnt affect you

I am interested in the assurance programmes as I export my produce around the world, I take notice of what is happening in world markets as I view this important to me and my business, my interests in my crop do not finish at the farm gate.

 

[teslacoils]

They should be able to.

It's more that they won't tell us what proceedure they use. The suspicion is that we gain market access by jumping through a lot of hoops and paying for accreditation. Imported grain can gain the same market access via a system of "self certification" where an associate of a clique can essentially rubber stamp it. The purchaors association say it's all stringently checked, but refuse to provide any details of the testing process, or facts to verify this.

Or that is my reading of the situation.

 

[robs1]

I am interested in the assurance programmes as I export my produce around the world, I take notice of what is happening in world markets as I view this important to me and my business, my interests in my crop do not finish at the farm gate.

But you said you dont grow grain so why is that of any interest to you ? You obviously dont know what imported grain rules are, I dont give a monkey's about fruit or veg assurance as I'm not a producer of those products

 

[SilliamWhale]

I would not be too happy about it, although I would not assume it does not meet the same standards of assurance, have you been to see what the other producers have to go through to have access to your market?

What if you know that it doesn't meet the same standards of assurance?

Or put it this way all attempts to find out what is done to see if does meet the same standards are either ignored or shut down . Would you after 20 years not start to get a little bit annoyed about it? All the while the standards you are adhering to are getting slowly ratcheted up...

 

[tullah]

If another product came in to compete with you how would you feel if they didn't have to do anything like what you do to access the market? ie they just sold the product on merit without the assurance?

Would you think its absolutely fine or would you find it unfair?

Same as Uk trained nurses here working in a nhs hospital. Said hospital brings in labourers from abroad to work along side uk trained nurses to do exactly same work at same rates of pay. And to cap it all hospital states, like our Jim did, that the foreign labourers are better qualified. I know how the Uk nurses would react.
But there's one subtle difference here and that is the Uk nurses qualification is worth the paper it's written on unlike the fraudulent rubbish RT one that a ten year old child writes up prior to inspection.
And why did the Nfu initially deny they owned RT. After a bit of digging it turns out that they are part owners / gaurantors of RT. What other porkies are they telling that have yet to be uncovered, This well and truly stinks and the farming press have now got a sniff of it and are determined to flush it out.

 

[stewart]

But you said you dont grow grain so why is that of any interest to you ? You obviously dont know what imported grain rules are, I dont give a monkey's about fruit or veg assurance as I'm not a producer of those products

Perhaps it may help to broaden your interests to get a better understanding of the markets.

 

[stewart]

It's more that they won't tell us what proceedure they use. The suspicion is that we gain market access by jumping through a lot of hoops and paying for accreditation. Imported grain can gain the same market access via a system of "self certification" where an associate of a clique can essentially rubber stamp it. The purchaors association say it's all stringently checked, but refuse to provide any details of the testing process, or facts to verify this.

Or that is my reading of the situation.

You may be reading the situation correctly, or you may not be. All I can tell you is the procedure we go through to have access to the markets, I would say the same procedure is put on other products that are going to those same markets. It is far more than a rubber stamping exercise and the penalties for going outside the criteria are horrendous, certainly not worth taking a risk over.

 

[stewart]

Hi Stewart,

The situation with grain in the UK is different to a normal supplier assurance scheme (like you probably have).

Our end users already purchase grain imports that has no audited assurance. It's complex but the grain mills are in an assurance scheme, and that scheme says UK suppliers must be farm level audited assured, but not the imports.

So our buyers are already purchasing non-assured. Hence why we're all annoyed.

If that is the case then you are understandably annoyed. I am quite surprised that the end buyer and consumer accept that!