580G starter slow and drawing a lot of current

[ACEngineering]

would you say there would be a hope in hell of my money back on the old one, or has it quite litteraly gone up in smoke with the starter...

That will be between you and who ever sold it/recommended it you. All i can offer is one that is capable of doing its job.

You seem very reluctant to give the actual part number or some reference to what you have actually bought, that will confirm what starter i think it is and how much better it will be.

 

[Jsmith2211]

That will be between you and who ever sold it/recommended it you. All i can offer is one that is capable of doing its job.

You seem very reluctant to give the actual part number or some reference to what you have actually bought, that will confirm what starter i think it is and how much better it will be.

I'm sorry, i've been quite busy today with fertiliser spreading and i've not had time to get the old starter off of the digger, hopefully tomorrow i will have time and can give you the number. Is the one on the sticker on the picture sent not the number you need?

 

[ACEngineering]

I'm sorry, i've been quite busy today with fertiliser spreading and i've not had time to get the old starter off of the digger, hopefully tomorrow i will have time and can give you the number. Is the one on the sticker on the picture sent not the number you need?

Cant see it on the picture, what does it say on the invoice?

 

[Fuzzy]

Its a good job i take pictures of this stuff... Hopefully you can get what you need from that image, else i'll get it tomorrow when it's light. Going to try to clean all the contacts on the block and everything first, cause i just cant bring myself to believe that a 2 month old brand new starter could pack up after not really having much use

It looks to me from that picture as if the 2 starters have different number of teeth, could just be the angle of the photo ???? Might be worth checking!

 

[Jsmith2211]

Cant see it on the picture, what does it say on the invoice?

It looks to me from that picture as if the 2 starters have different number of teeth, could just be the angle of the photo ???? Might be worth checking!

OK.... So earlier on someone mentioned a hydraulic service dead ending could be the possible issue here, and that would appear to be the issue... Hooked the battery up to the maxxum, because it has the biggest alternator, and that managed to turn it over a little quicker, quick enough that i could hear a swishing type sound coming from the loader spool block, so i wiggled that joystick around and for the first time it started up fully from cold without a drop of easy start! So i think i have found the issue. seems like if i hold the joystick in the right place the engine runs nicely, no load on it and the starter cranks it over lovely and quick. If i let it go into the middle it makes the swishing sound and slows the engine a lot. Is there any adjustment in the spool block or is there something stuck inside the block that needs to come apart and be cleaned out? Taking off that spool looks to be a bit of a faff (3 spool services for the loader, and the thing isnt exactly rust free). The oil is black and milky and has been since we got it, water is getting in through the filler cap in the top of the res i think but i dont know where the hell i'd get a replacement filler cap. Was going to try to flush the system out in a week or two when ive time and get the new hydraulic filter on there that i've got in the shed... then maybe a plastic bag over the fill plug to stop water getting in again. I just hope that the tank isnt rusty on the inside and getting bits of rust in the hydraulic system because that would be a nightmare... At least it shows the pump is nice and strong though!

 

[ACEngineering]

OK.... So earlier on someone mentioned a hydraulic service dead ending could be the possible issue here, and that would appear to be the issue... Hooked the battery up to the maxxum, because it has the biggest alternator, and that managed to turn it over a little quicker, quick enough that i could hear a swishing type sound coming from the loader spool block, so i wiggled that joystick around and for the first time it started up fully from cold without a drop of easy start! So i think i have found the issue. seems like if i hold the joystick in the right place the engine runs nicely, no load on it and the starter cranks it over lovely and quick. If i let it go into the middle it makes the swishing sound and slows the engine a lot. Is there any adjustment in the spool block or is there something stuck inside the block that needs to come apart and be cleaned out? Taking off that spool looks to be a bit of a faff (3 spool services for the loader, and the thing isnt exactly rust free). The oil is black and milky and has been since we got it, water is getting in through the filler cap in the top of the res i think but i dont know where the hell i'd get a replacement filler cap. Was going to try to flush the system out in a week or two when ive time and get the new hydraulic filter on there that i've got in the shed... then maybe a plastic bag over the fill plug to stop water getting in again. I just hope that the tank isnt rusty on the inside and getting bits of rust in the hydraulic system because that would be a nightmare... At least it shows the pump is nice and strong though!

Cant help with the lever as i don't know the machine. Spools will normally have a spring on the end of the pool rod to centre it so either the spring is broken or spool cap or loose the linkage is stiff or as a worse case the spool rod is damaged.

 

[Jsmith2211]

Cant help with the lever as i don't know the machine. Spools will normally have a spring on the end of the pool rod to centre it so either the spring is broken or spool cap or loose the linkage is stiff or as a worse case the spool rod is damaged.

So probably not something stuck inside the spool block?

 

[ACEngineering]

So probably not something stuck inside the spool block?

Well it might be the spool rod yes but could be the spring on the end of it or the linkage.
Disconnect the linkage at the spool and see if the linkage is free.

 

[agrimax]

Does pt no.1 look like what you need? Pt no.D94386.

The parts list shows the oil tank lid to have an incorporated dipstick. Any CNH dealer should be able to supply. Here's one on ebay... Not out of the way in price if it keeps the wet stuff out...

Genuine New Case Dipstick | D94386 | New Old Stock • £32.50

GENUINE NEW CASE Dipstick | D94386 | New Old Stock - £32.50. FOR SALE! Genuine New Case Dipstick | D94386 | New Old Stock Dispatched within two working days, with Royal Mail Second Class. 174544026122

picclick.co.uk

 

[Jsmith2211]

Does pt no.1 look like what you need? Pt no.D94386.
View attachment 954951


The parts list shows the oil tank lid to have an incorporated dipstick. Any CNH dealer should be able to supply. Here's one on ebay... Not out of the way in price if it keeps the wet stuff out...

Genuine New Case Dipstick | D94386 | New Old Stock • £32.50

GENUINE NEW CASE Dipstick | D94386 | New Old Stock - £32.50. FOR SALE! Genuine New Case Dipstick | D94386 | New Old Stock Dispatched within two working days, with Royal Mail Second Class. 174544026122

picclick.co.uk

Looks like the one, will get that ordered, then get that oil changed out of there as i expect that has something to do with the hydraulic issue i am now facing. its worth putting a little bit of money into I think, because the hydraulics are good and strong, and while the cab is very very rusty, 580s are known for that... It digs holes quite well and its a very useful little machine to have about for ditching and suchlike, has the reach of a far bigger machine.

While im at it on the questions, ive got a couple of diesel leaks coming from the injector lines at the back of the pump, at the fitting between the banjo line and the injector line (one of them at the banjo itself). Do these have O rings in them? They are all good and tight so im guessing its just buggered O rings or something like that.

 

[davidroberts30]

Looks like the one, will get that ordered, then get that oil changed out of there as i expect that has something to do with the hydraulic issue i am now facing. its worth putting a little bit of money into I think, because the hydraulics are good and strong, and while the cab is very very rusty, 580s are known for that... It digs holes quite well and its a very useful little machine to have about for ditching and suchlike, has the reach of a far bigger machine.

While im at it on the questions, ive got a couple of diesel leaks coming from the injector lines at the back of the pump, at the fitting between the banjo line and the injector line (one of them at the banjo itself). Do these have O rings in them? They are all good and tight so im guessing its just buggered O rings or something like that.

Copper washers

 

[Mur Huwcun]

Copper washers

And change the lot. Assemble the fittings loosly with new washers and blow them with airline to ensure thefaces are spotless before tightening them. I’d suggest doing it with the engine nice and warm aswell if you’re having a bit of starting issues as it will bleed through and start back up much easier!!

 

[manhill]

In retrospect, the starter getting hot and turning slowly indicated mechanical resistance and the connections on the lines from the battery are passing large current ok. A voltmete r connected across the battery terminal and motor side of the solenoid while cranking would confirm this, look for no more than about 1/2 Volt, same applies on the -ve side (motor body to battery negative terminal. In my opinion, too much is expected of typical jumper leads given the actual contact area the clips make, some even don't have the teeth on one side connected to the cable.

 

[Jsmith2211]

In retrospect, the starter getting hot and turning slowly indicated mechanical resistance and the connections on the lines from the battery are passing large current ok. A voltmete r connected across the battery terminal and motor side of the solenoid while cranking would confirm this, look for no more than about 1/2 Volt, same applies on the -ve side (motor body to battery negative terminal. In my opinion, too much is expected of typical jumper leads given the actual contact area the clips make, some even don't have the teeth on one side connected to the cable.

Dont think there is even 0.1 of a volt of voltage drop between the battery and starter. Seems to turn over a lot better with the maxxum hooked up to the battery though

 

[Jsmith2211]

And change the lot. Assemble the fittings loosly with new washers and blow them with airline to ensure thefaces are spotless before tightening them. I’d suggest doing it with the engine nice and warm aswell if you’re having a bit of starting issues as it will bleed through and start back up much easier!!

Copper washers

copper washers in the banjo fittings but in the other injector line ones as well? I think with the masseys its a little rubber O ring, where would the copper washer go on a normal fitting?

 

[Mur Huwcun]

copper washers in the banjo fittings but in the other injector line ones as well? I think with the masseys its a little rubber O ring, where would the copper washer go on a normal fitting?

The other lines are just flared or olive. Sometimes just a dissasemble and clean will sort them