AB9 mid tier winter bird food (cheap ideas)

[willy]

Does anyone know what is the most efficient and legal way to establish for mid tier agreement. I want to provide what is necessary but also optimize my earning potential from this option.

the wording of the agreement is as follows

'Annual mixtures should include species LIKE barley, triticale, quinoa, linseed, millet, mustard, fodder radish and sunflower. Include kale in 2- year mixtures. The mixture should cover a range of crop groups to minimise any pest and disease risks. no single species should make up more than 70% by weight of the mix.


as you can see i have underlined 'like' as it is gives a bit of leeway.

so could i use my own wheat, barley, linseed, osr? do i have to include millet or mustard?

 

[Brisel]

Millet & mustard are cheap enough though think whether you'd want it setting seed in a plot you might want to grow a non cereal on in the future. I grow mixes with 2 year options like kale and chicory which means you're not replacing it every year plus you only lose 2 arable crops on that plot instead of 3.

You're liable for BSPB royalties on every farm saved species - maybe buying a mix from a merchant isn't so expensive after all? Have a chat with Oakbank, Hubbards or Brights and explain your needs. They make their own mixes so might knock you up a bespoke batch. The best chap to speak to in here is @Great In Grass

 

[spin cycle]

quick surf....2ac sunflower £30...2ac millet £18.50.....2ac fodder radish £30.....2ac mustard £18.50.....4.5 ac....so 325kg cereal seed....say £160

therefore 5 ha birdcover for £257....or say £52/ha


edit one
oh feck...hang on.....no group more than 90% by wt ......back to the drawing board james

edit two....i'll be back

just on the cusp of the 90%

 

[willy]

i just feel that paying effectivley £2500 per tonne for seed is excessive, i am also a seed processor with BSPB and can easily sort out royalties.

i just think we need to be maximisng these schemes to our benefit and not just another supply company, maybe its not worth the hassle?

 

[Great In Grass]

Does anyone know what is the most efficient and legal way to establish for mid tier agreement. I want to provide what is necessary but also optimize my earning potential from this option.

the wording of the agreement is as follows

'Annual mixtures should include species LIKE barley, triticale, quinoa, linseed, millet, mustard, fodder radish and sunflower. Include kale in 2- year mixtures. The mixture should cover a range of crop groups to minimise any pest and disease risks. no single species should make up more than 70% by weight of the mix.


as you can see i have underlined 'like' as it is gives a bit of leeway.

so could i use my own wheat, barley, linseed, osr? do i have to include millet or mustard?

Last updated 25 February 2020.

Establish by sowing a seed mix which contains at least 6 seed bearing crops between 15 February and 15 June. Seed mixes may contain a maximum of 3 of the following cereal crops - barley, oats, rye, triticale and wheat. No individual crop group must exceed 90% of the total mix by weight.

Sow plants that offer a spread of seed across the late autumn and winter.

Annual mixtures should include species like barley, triticale, quinoa, linseed, millet, mustard, fodder radish and sunflower. Include kale in 2-year mixtures. The mixture should cover a range of crop groups to minimise any pest and disease risks.

No single crop group, such as cereals or oilseeds, should exceed 90% of the total seed mix by weight.

You can add your own seed and the seed house can then provide an "equivalent" mixture to bring the mixture in line with an AB9 mixture.

 

[Great In Grass]

i just feel that paying effectivley £2500 per tonne for seed is excessive, i am also a seed processor with BSPB and can easily sort out royalties.

i just think we need to be maximisng these schemes to our benefit and not just another supply company, maybe its not worth the hassle?

A tonne of a one year mix of AB9 is going to be around £1000.00/tonne cheaper than your quoted figure.

 

[Great In Grass]

just on the cusp of the 90%

Forget the Sunflowers, pretty but expensive.

 

[Brisel]

Sunflowers are a great addition to a seed bearing mix, but this thread is about cost, not benefit

 

[GeorgeK]

I will be looking for a brassica free mix to redrill my area after flea beetles ate most of it, kale and linseed a waste of time now

 

[willy]

I will be looking for a brassica free mix to redrill my area after flea beetles ate most of it, kale and linseed a waste of time now

this is the problem im having with the 2 year mixes, the kale just isnt there!!

 

[Brisel]

Have you got any ideas for year 2 seed @Great In Grass ? My kale didn't establish well last year either. Some was fine, other plots had none in at all. Chicory did well but it's not enough by itself.

Beet is a biennial.

 

[Great In Grass]

this is the problem im having with the 2 year mixes, the kale just isnt there!!

Have you got any ideas for year 2 seed @Great In Grass ? My kale didn't establish well last year either. Some was fine, other plots had none in at all. Chicory did well but it's not enough by itself.

Beet is a biennial.

I will have a look, the Kale content could be reduced down to 1% I guess and the slack could be taken up by increasing the existing constituents or the addition of something else?

 

[willy]

How about as a one year mix, beans, peas, s wheat, s barley and and s oats.
Would this cover enough bases.

working on the cost of fss seed being £200 tonne for each product mixed togeather and drilled at a rate of 100kg/ha total mix

£200/ 1000kg =. 0.2x100kg/ha seed rate =£20 /ha for a decent seed rate rather than the cheeky £50 per acre ( why they sell in acre packs.)

 

[willy]

I will have a look, the Kale content could be reduced down to 1% I guess and the slack could be taken up by increasing the existing constituents or the addition of something else?

Have to say your mixes last year where good but 60% on heavier land the kale got decimated.

 

[Feldspar]

The guidance has changed in 2020 for AB9 so that more small seeds have to be included. I need to ring the DEFRA helpline to ask whether agreements that started say in 2019, like ours did, have to meet these new rules, or whether we can follow the ones in place we we signed up. The old rules allowed you to plant a mixture of spring wheat, spring barley and spring oats as an example, and you could use your own seed as long as you had evidence of what you'd done. It's easier with bought in mixtures as you have the receipt.

 

[willy]

£

So £120 ha x 10 ha = £1200
Where my mix @£20 x10=£200 for a lot more seed and £1000 in my pocket too. Got to be looked at surley

 

[willy]

The guidance has changed in 2020 for AB9 so that more small seeds have to be included. I need to ring the DEFRA helpline to ask whether agreements that started say in 2019, like ours did, have to meet these new rules, or whether we can follow the ones in place we we signed up. The old rules allowed you to plant a mixture of spring wheat, spring barley and spring oats as an example, and you could use your own seed as long as you had evidence of what you'd done. It's easier with bought in mixtures as you have the receipt.

Where does it say in the guidance that you have to use more smaller seeds, I think I’m right in writing in my first post the latest guidance.

 

[willy]

 

[Feldspar]

Where does it say in the guidance that you have to use more smaller seeds, I think I’m right in writing in my first post the latest guidance.

I was thinking of this new piece of wording: "Establish by sowing a seed mix which contains at least 6 seed bearing crops between 15 February and 15 June. Seed mixes may contain a maximum of 3 of the following cereal crops - barley, oats, rye, triticale and wheat. No individual crop group must exceed 90% of the total mix by weight."

I admit I read it quickly, but I thought you need 3 non-cereal crops so that meant using smaller seeds. That wasn't best way of putting it. More that I couldn't do a mixture of spring barley, spring wheat and spring triticale and use a wider range of herbicides.

AB9: Winter bird food

Find out about eligibility and requirements for the winter bird food option.

www.gov.uk

 

[willy]

So no mention on size of seed so you could sow

wheat
Barley
Oats
Beans
Peas
Linseed/S osr