Tony Blair is a demonstrable ****

[Danllan]

I personally don't mind that Blair got a knighthood. But I do object to these armies of Sir Humphreys who automatically get a knighthood, simply by climbing the greasy pole to a certain position. No matter how good or useless they turn out to be. The award should be for outstanding service to the United Kingdom or humanity in general.

On the criteria you stipulate, WTF has TB done to deserve one...???

 

[BrianV]

Quite right, barring the last bit.


No. The damage he did to the Constitution is unforgiveable, and all for his own short-term gain. Add in his criminal dishonesty and the vast amount of entirely unnecessary blood on his hands and he is beneath contempt; a disgusting and arrogant liar, hypocrite, nepotist, coward and egotist.

Think the very same or if not more can be easily said of Brown & the left wing crowd backing him, seem to remember Blair didn’t even want to ban fox hunting!

 

[Bongodog]

Let’s be honest the Queen doesn’t make these awards in a vacuum. Blair has been awarded a knighthood by a backward facing establishment. I haven’t clicked on the petition but his “honour” just confirms the system is a throw back to a previous time. I understand many of the crusaders were knights of the realm. So I suppose this does have a resonance with England’s medieval history. Best one can say about it.

Blair has not been awarded a knighthood, knighthoods are awarded via the honours committee and they typically hand out around 40 knighthoods/damehoods every 6 months.
He has been admitted to the order of the garter, this is in the personal gift of the Queen and membership is restricted to a maximum of 24 at any one time. She has made every one of her PM's part of this order apart from Macmillan who declined the offer

 

[Ashtree]

And here lies one of the problems with our social media culture, despite the fact he didn't get a knighthood awarded by the govt, over 600k so far are stupid enough to click a petition to the govt asking them to review the decision.
Doesn't anyone actually read anything and try to understand it before reacting ?

The Brexit referendum proved beyond all reasonable doubt, that the capacity of a large portion of the population to read important stuff, is practically zero.

 

[BrianV]

The Brexit referendum proved beyond all reasonable doubt, that the capacity of a large portion of the population to read important stuff, is practically zero.

It also proved that some people who are on the losing side of a referendum will never accept a democratic decision!

 

[Muck Spreader]

On the criteria you stipulate, WTF has TB done to deserve one...???

I have suggested a criteria on which an honour should be bestowed, not why Blair should or should not receive one. This was a decision for the queen and the committee who evidently deem him worthy of the award.

Can you justify the Johnston's stuffing of the House of Lords with party donors, personal friends, MP's who lost their seats, unelected advisors who become government ministers and Russian nationals?

 

[BrianV]

Whilst Blair is not everyone's cup of tea he has I think been made a patsy for US blunders.

He made a reasonable pact with Bush 12 mths before IRAQ was invaded that understandably the UK would of course back the US in any fight with Saddam Hussein, the yanks then started what was in effect a giant misguided bluff to force Hussein to back down by threatening invasion if he did not capitulate.
Unfortunately for us he did not play ball & the US & UK were forced to start to back up these threats or else look totally weak, as this went on more & more troops & equipment were being poured over there in the genuine believe that he would have to back down, unfortunately he didn't.
The trouble was that the US had stupidly chosen late spring to call his bluff & as the intense heat of summer started they suddenly realised that they could not keep their troops in that intense heat for long so they had no choice but to either back down look stupid & go home or carry out their up to now bluffing threats.
Blair was simply a totally naive politician manipulated by very experienced war hungry US politicians many of whom had links with the arms industry who believed a pidlly little country like Iraq would quickly recognise the USA's overwhelming power, sadly Hussein didn't really believe they would go through with it!
Blair wasn't great but when compared with what has followed if you count out Iraq was he really any worse than what we have now?

 

[Lowland1]

In fairness, he ran away once his sins were found out, knowing without any doubt at all that he was unelectable once they were.

Anyone suggesting he'd have won in 2005 if the dirt had come out before / during it is barking.

That’s democracy for you. Good when it gives you what you like eg Brexit. Bad when it gives you what you don’t like eg Tony Blair. As for a barking mad electorate by 2010 they still weren’t too fussed and it took the Liberals to help the Tories get in .

 

[Henarar]

The Brexit referendum proved beyond all reasonable doubt, that the capacity of a large portion of the population to read important stuff, is practically zero.

Absolutely, a large portion of the population of not only the UK but Ireland and France to could not read the result and are still moaning about it now.
Happy new year to all you re...... BTW

 

[Danllan]

I have suggested a criteria on which an honour should be bestowed, not why Blair should or should not receive one. This was a decision for the queen and the committee who evidently deem him worthy of the award.

Can you justify the Johnston's stuffing of the House of Lords with party donors, personal friends, MP's who lost their seats, unelected advisors who become government ministers and Russian nationals?

Ha! You'll have to point me to any post I've ever made defending the monarchy, or 'honours' - other than for gallantry and the like. But you'll have a hard time, because I am and have always made it clear that I am a republican and against such rubbish.

That written, and with regard to your first paragraph, there did seem to be an inference that you thought TB worthy, if not fair enough, but it wasn't clear. But... both in law and practice the Garter is solely in the gift of the reigning Monarch, no committee, just her own God-anointed self...

That’s democracy for you. Good when it gives you what you like eg Brexit. Bad when it gives you what you don’t like eg Tony Blair. As for a barking mad electorate by 2010 they still weren’t too fussed and it took the Liberals to help the Tories get in .

Clearly you have misunderstood my post, I don't argue with democracy, being one of the strongest advocates for it on here, I even wish it for others - such as the EU.

You have also forgotten that TB wasn't electable, and only by binning him did Labour get the result they had in 2010. Check the polls and other votes prior to and after he was kicked out.

 

[Danllan]

The Brexit referendum proved beyond all reasonable doubt, that the capacity of a large portion of the population to read important stuff, is practically zero.

Just out of interest, do you believe that to be true of all populations, of just that of the UK...?

 

[Lowland1]

Ha! You'll have to point me to any post I've ever made defending the monarchy, or 'honours' - other than for gallantry and the like. But you'll have a hard time, because I am and have always made it clear that I am a republican and against such rubbish.

That written, and with regard to your first paragraph, there did seem to be an inference that you thought TB worthy, if not fair enough, but it wasn't clear. But... both in law and practice the Garter is solely in the gift of the reigning Monarch, no committee, just her own God-anointed self...



Clearly you have misunderstood my post, I don't argue with democracy, being one of the strongest advocates for it on here, I even wish it for others - such as the EU.

You have also forgotten that TB wasn't electable, and only by binning him did Labour get the result they had in 2010. Check the polls and other votes prior to and after he was kicked out.

Nope i understood your post. If Tony Blair was unelectable it was because the face no longer fitted people were getting tired of the grin a bit like people had got tired of Margaret Thatcher and so it was time for a change difference was John Major managed to win his election Gordon Brown didn’t. The thing about democracy is folk often just like a change and the longer someone is in power the greater the contempt they have for the people who put them in power.

 

[jendan]

Ha! You'll have to point me to any post I've ever made defending the monarchy, or 'honours' - other than for gallantry and the like. But you'll have a hard time, because I am and have always made it clear that I am a republican and against such rubbish.

That written, and with regard to your first paragraph, there did seem to be an inference that you thought TB worthy, if not fair enough, but it wasn't clear. But... both in law and practice the Garter is solely in the gift of the reigning Monarch, no committee, just her own God-anointed self...



Clearly you have misunderstood my post, I don't argue with democracy, being one of the strongest advocates for it on here, I even wish it for others - such as the EU.

You have also forgotten that TB wasn't electable, and only by binning him did Labour get the result they had in 2010. Check the polls and other votes prior to and after he was kicked out.

Blair wasnt kicked out.He stood down to let Gordon Brown have a go. He probably would have won in 2010 for a fourth term if he had stayed.

 

[Danllan]

Blair wasnt kicked out.He stood down to let Gordon Brown have a go. He probably would have won in 2010 for a fourth term if he had stayed.

I should have made myself clearer. TB was kicked out, by and from within the Labour Party - I have very good friends who were members at the time and know this to be the case. It was analogous to Margaret Thatcher 'standing down', i.e. there was no choice but to do so or be binned - it all amounts to the same thing, electoral liability spells leaving...

There was no chance of TB winning a fourth term, just look at the contemporary polls for his and his party's ratings with him as leader. GB was believed to be better by the party and population as a whole.

Nope i understood your post. If Tony Blair was unelectable it was because the face no longer fitted people were getting tired of the grin a bit like people had got tired of Margaret Thatcher and so it was time for a change difference was John Major managed to win his election Gordon Brown didn’t. The thing about democracy is folk often just like a change and the longer someone is in power the greater the contempt they have for the people who put them in power.

We agree that TB was contemptuous, the facts dictate that he was and still is contemptible too.

 

[Hindsight]

I should have made myself clearer. TB was kicked out, by and from within the Labour Party - I have very good friends who were members at the time and know this to be the case. It was analogous to Margaret Thatcher 'standing down', i.e. there was no choice but to do so or be binned - it all amounts to the same thing, electoral liability spells leaving...

There was no chance of TB winning a fourth term, just look at the contemporary polls for his and his party's ratings with him as leader. GB was believed to be better by the party and population as a whole.


We agree that TB was contemptuous, the facts dictate that he was and still is contemptible too.

I always thought Tony was a really good Tory PM for the period he was PM. Labours chances fell away as soon as they appointed a true Labour man as PM in 2007.

 

[BrianV]

I should have made myself clearer. TB was kicked out, by and from within the Labour Party - I have very good friends who were members at the time and know this to be the case. It was analogous to Margaret Thatcher 'standing down', i.e. there was no choice but to do so or be binned - it all amounts to the same thing, electoral liability spells leaving...

There was no chance of TB winning a fourth term, just look at the contemporary polls for his and his party's ratings with him as leader. GB was believed to be better by the party and population as a whole.


We agree that TB was contemptuous, the facts dictate that he was and still is contemptible too.

And didn’t left winger Brown do well, remind me how many elections did he win or have Labour won ever since?
If Blair was so bad he would have not won three clear elections.

 

[linga]

And didn’t left winger Brown do well, remind me how many elections did he win or have Labour won ever since?
If Blair was so bad he would have not won three clear elections.

It’s not necessarily how bad the incumbent is but how bad the opposition is.

 

[BrianV]

It’s not necessarily how bad the incumbent is but how bad the opposition is.

Or simply the fact that the country couldn’t stand Brown & his left wing cohorts, without Blair they have continued to be unelectable in spite of the Tories unpopularity.

 

[Ashtree]

Just out of interest, do you believe that to be true of all populations, of just that of the UK...?

I believe it to be true of most if not all nations. I believe the average attention span to detail, has been greatly shortened by the “tweet” world we live in today.
I further believe, that two major powers in particular. USA and UK, have become particularly targeted by Russia, in a very successful attempt to date, to undermine their electoral systems. Why USA and UK in particular? Well we all know why USA, as it’s the great military power. Why UK? Because it is seen as the second military power in NATO. Perhaps in real numbers and hardware, France is now ahead of UK, militarily???
I also believe the thrash / tabloid media world, long before social media, got a foothold in UK, unlike most other countries. It too managed to capture the hearts and minds of the plebs, in a manner which seriously lowered their willingness and eventually ability, to read beyond dog whistle headlines, back page footie and page three titty!!

 

[BrianV]

I believe it to be true of most if not all nations. I believe the average attention span to detail, has been greatly shortened by the “tweet” world we live in today.
I further believe, that two major powers in particular. USA and UK, have become particularly targeted by Russia, in a very successful attempt to date, to undermine their electoral systems. Why USA and UK in particular? Well we all know why USA, as it’s the great military power. Why UK? Because it is seen as the second military power in NATO. Perhaps in real numbers and hardware, France is now ahead of UK, militarily???
I also believe the thrash / tabloid media world, long before social media, got a foothold in UK, unlike most other countries. It too managed to capture the hearts and minds of the plebs, in a manner which seriously lowered their willingness and eventually ability, to read beyond dog whistle headlines, back page footie and page three titty!!

Surprised it’s not those aliens that are to blame for electoral defeats, still I guess those pesky Russians will have to do!