Welger Small Baler

[ollandroverman]

most anoying thing with the 456 is it doesnt sit square behind the tractor, have to drive in a hedge with it.

Modify your drawbar

 

[Jsmith2211]

Modify your drawbar

Not worth it when the machine is going

 

[ollandroverman]

Well i've never got on with the knotters. Make a lovely knot now after thousands spent, but still drops occasionally on the one side for no reason whatsoever, will do 700 bales not drop one then start missing for no reason, drop a few then tie the loveliest knot you have ever seen. No confidence in the machine any more. And that has kind of put me off the JD. Other than that it is a damn good baler makes a lovely bale and is fast. Just feel I want something different now after the last couple of years of very expensive ownership!

They aren't know for having poor knotters. Perhaps you are just missing that little something.
Or to put it another way...the next owner could be buying a good baler all at your expense.

 

[HCC]

Also 630 compared to 730, main difference I can find is there is no sheer bolt on the 730 and it weighs another 300 kilos? Doesnt look like there is any real increase in speed? Why would you have a 730 over a 630...

730 is a different animal to a 630, heavier duty frame and no shear bolt on the flywheel. Huge difference in output due to the size of the throat. Had a 730 here since new in 1990, been a fantastic machine and has done a huge amount of work.
I have baled straw behind a 40ft header a few times and the only limitation is the pickup width.
Whether you will be able to make use of that output is a different question, I like to see 10 wads in a bale of hay to keep them tidy and consistent length, so if you reduce the chamber size to standard, you will get the same output as any other baler with 90 ram strokes a minute!

 

[roscoe erf]

Does it make much odds? Could think for haylage a "heavier duty" baler might make sense but for nice dry hay and straw...? To be honest the 630 looks a good baler, so long as you can reduce the size of the chamber down.

And what sort of age should I be looking at for a reliable one? Really dont want to buy another lemon.

I'm still running my 1990 welder ap630 never touched the knotters bale length is adjustable handles the swaths fine better than a jd I had

 

[davidroberts30]

Im sure 830 has a bigger bale chamber too making bigger bale

 

[Jsmith2211]

They aren't know for having poor knotters. Perhaps you are just missing that little something.
Or to put it another way...the next owner could be buying a good baler all at your expense.

it’s a good baler like I say, in straw tying 99% of the time, when I got it back into hay it started missing again, couple of times after about 50 bales but more likely it would do 200, drop one or two then do another 200. I expect it’s either something really simple somewhere that we’ve missed or it’s a new knotter on that side and away you go but like I say, my mechanic and I have spent days on it, I’ve got a big bill to show for it and I’ve just not got the confidence in it to pour even more money in. When I got it the supposedly fully working baler wouldn’t do more than 10 without dropping - got done over by the Cornish… If I was doing 2000 odd bales with it I’d just keep it and put up with pulling a few bales out of the sledge, but for contracting and the capacity I want to be doing i need something I can rely on. If you want it you are welcome to buy it!

 

[Magnus Oyke]

Also pickup width, is a 630 equivalent in terms of width of pickup? Just needs to be able to fit the whole width of my combine swath into it!

The swath from my Claas 660 just fits up the reel on the AP630.

I've not used an inline Massey, but you'll get a wider pickup reel for narrower overall width. My feeling is that people that buy new Massey's buy them for hard work, so a used one is likely to have seen a lot of action. With a good set of knotters in it, you'll have trouble beating a Welger

 

[David.]

Are Welger bits still easily obtained?

 

[jd6820]

it’s a good baler like I say, in straw tying 99% of the time, when I got it back into hay it started missing again, couple of times after about 50 bales but more likely it would do 200, drop one or two then do another 200. I expect it’s either something really simple somewhere that we’ve missed or it’s a new knotter on that side and away you go but like I say, my mechanic and I have spent days on it, I’ve got a big bill to show for it and I’ve just not got the confidence in it to pour even more money in. When I got it the supposedly fully working baler wouldn’t do more than 10 without dropping - got done over by the Cornish… If I was doing 2000 odd bales with it I’d just keep it and put up with pulling a few bales out of the sledge, but for contracting and the capacity I want to be doing i need something I can rely on. If you want it you are welcome to buy it!

It would annoy me not to get to the bottom of the knotting fault before moving it on. I run a JD 456, which has a narrower reel than a 456a. Not had bother following a 17ft header, struggles with a 21ft header and large amounts of straw say from Oats. But knotting wise, I know there is something wrong if it misses 1 in 2000 bales. Only misses I get is my badly tied knots between bundles. Got some maintainance to do this winter as spotted tight knife arm rollers when cleaning off at the end of the season. I'd get someone like the baler doctor to have a look at it and sort the knotter issues.

 

[Jsmith2211]

It would annoy me not to get to the bottom of the knotting fault before moving it on. I run a JD 456, which has a narrower reel than a 456a. Not had bother following a 17ft header, struggles with a 21ft header and large amounts of straw say from Oats. But knotting wise, I know there is something wrong if it misses 1 in 2000 bales. Only misses I get is my badly tied knots between bundles. Got some maintainance to do this winter as spotted tight knife arm rollers when cleaning off at the end of the season. I'd get someone like the baler doctor to have a look at it and sort the knotter issues.

Have already had several people look at it, there is litteraly nothing wrong with the knotter but it still drops the odd one. It makes no sense, and I’m not arsing around with it any more. Like I say it ties most of the time and might do a field without dropping one, or I might get it out of the shed and it will start missing again. Apart from that it’s a mint baler really nothing wrong with it apart from lack of hydraulic pickup and drawbar

 

[oilcan]

Bought a Welger AP61 like that over 40 years ago, one side would miss regularly even though both adjusted the same. Reset packer timing which was advanced to the specified tolerance,retarded it instead.Then retimed the needles.From then on the baler was faster and both notters tied near perfectly.

 

[Magnus Oyke]

Are Welger bits still easily obtained?

Yes, no issues at all

 

[jackstor]

Ran a 730 for 20+ years, very good baler, simply to maintain with no chains on it. We put deflector plates on the back of our combine just to tighten the swath up. Baled behind a 30ft header and 20ft headers rowed up 2 into 1, odd bits do miss the pick up but it’s very little, it just doesn’t look good when your contracting, but no one’s ever complained ( helps when your the only one with a small baler in the parish!)
830 will be a big machine on the road. A hydraulic drawbar makes a massive difference for getting into fields and also on dykebacks and untidy rows.
You would’ve thought AGCO would bring out a Fendt Welger small baler and left the inline ones Massey

 

[Chuckie]

Have already had several people look at it, there is litteraly nothing wrong with the knotter but it still drops the odd one. It makes no sense, and I’m not arsing around with it any more. Like I say it ties most of the time and might do a field without dropping one, or I might get it out of the shed and it will start missing again. Apart from that it’s a mint baler really nothing wrong with it apart from lack of hydraulic pickup and drawbar

Likely to be something simple, we once had a baler that acted similar, turned out to be a burr on the end of the ram would sometimes catch on the twine and pull it out of the knotter before it was tied

 

[jackstor]

Ours started throwing loose ones on one side, after going through all the knotters, it was the guide on the needle eye had worn, leaving a sharp bit

 

[Will 1594]

Im sure 830 has a bigger bale chamber too making bigger bale

Same size chamber ,shaft drive like 730 , but 2 m pickup

 

[Dry Rot]

Ours started throwing loose ones on one side, after going through all the knotters, it was the guide on the needle eye had worn, leaving a sharp bit

Rust on the twine tensioners on mine.

 

[Boohoo]

Could the knotting problem be a twine issue? I've had similar issues of baling say 100 perfectly then the next 5 being broken then going on to bale perfectly again without any adjustment. When I inspected the twine it was thinner in places and a different brand of twine cured the problem.

Anyone got the dimensions of the feed opening in the Welgers? I'm guessing it's a lot bigger than most others because if the ram strokes per minute are similar then the only way to get a higher output is to put more in with each stroke. The power requirement seems higher too, but that makes sense if the Welger is putting more in with each stroke.

 

[jd6820]

Have already had several people look at it, there is litteraly nothing wrong with the knotter but it still drops the odd one. It makes no sense, and I’m not arsing around with it any more. Like I say it ties most of the time and might do a field without dropping one, or I might get it out of the shed and it will start missing again. Apart from that it’s a mint baler really nothing wrong with it apart from lack of hydraulic pickup and drawbar

Should be able to do at least 6000 bales without knotting problems we do that yearly with ours and probably done 2 consecutive seasons without mis-tying. I agree you can have perfectly set up knotters and string guides worn, rubbish string, grooves in needles, sharp edges on needle slots, heck I've had a sharp edge on tucker finger mounting thats caught the twine when travelling along the headland with no material feeding in and the slack in the string has been caught. Yet when baling the constant feeding meant the string didnt get time to dwell and hook around the bracket. Just takes a keen eye to spot these things. Had a new holland this season dropping bales and the reason was the twine not routed through the twine guide on the needle carriage. Tied fine most of the time and not others, wasn't looking for badly routed twine and baler had panels around the needle carriage so not easy to spot on first glance... I'd stick with it personally, unless you are after trying a Welger to see if they really are the baler to beat.