YEN

[SilliamWhale]

How many of you have done the YEN stuff where they analyse your grain and you theoretically work backwards to see what you could have improved on nutritionally?

If so, any want to discuss it?

I've done it

 

[ajd132]

How many of you have done the YEN stuff where they analyse your grain and you theoretically work backwards to see what you could have improved on nutritionally?

If so, any want to discuss it?

I've done it

Yes. Didn’t really know what to do with the data/. Changed a few things, dont think it made any difference. All abit woolly this micro nutrition stuff. Been doing the sap testing stuff aswell. Don’t think il bother this year.

the problem is you can spend so much time faffing around minutia of marginal gain stuff and take your eye off the ball doing basics well - like checking a drain isn’t blocked or missing your t2 timing because your at a meeting about micro nutrients and biologicals!

 

[SilliamWhale]

This feels exactly my view, I think.

I got it for free under Farming Connect but I'm still not sure what to make of it - if anything. Its interesting but is it just academic?

If the grain comes up with any glaring deficiencies in any of the macronutrients then my feeling is you are not farming well enough in the first place and keeping an eye on the soil tests.

So then all I have left to worry about is something like low copper or low zinc but again not sure how transitory that would be or how yield worrying it could be. Just because a nutrient isn't in the grain does it necessarily mean that the nutrient was never there when the plant needed it? We know potash can ebb and flow as the plant ripens

 

[ajd132]

This feels exactly my view, I think.

I got it for free under Farming Connect but I'm still not sure what to make of it - if anything. Its interesting but is it just academic?

If the grain comes up with any glaring deficiencies in any of the macronutrients then my feeling is you are not farming well enough in the first place and keeping an eye on the soil tests.

So then all I have left to worry about is something like low copper or low zinc but again not sure how transitory that would be or how yield worrying it could be. Just because a nutrient isn't in the grain does it necessarily mean that the nutrient was never there when the plant needed it? We know potash can ebb and flow as the plant ripens

I’ve just gone back to dolloping chicken muck or sludge on where I can rather than getting all hung up on this stuff.

but I agree if anything is massively wrong it should be obvious to you before doing all this stuff.

 

[SilliamWhale]

Don't get me on about biologicals again!

I read an article in Chemical Placement Monthly the other day where they did some trials involving varying rates of some wonder product that came in a small can and would not have contained a lot of nitrogen but what the trial didn't do was a control where there is no wonder product used and so the whole thing was junk! It annoys me

 

[Salopian_Will]

Yes. Didn’t really know what to do with the data/. Changed a few things, dont think it made any difference. All abit woolly this micro nutrition stuff. Been doing the sap testing stuff aswell. Don’t think il bother this year.

the problem is you can spend so much time faffing around minutia of marginal gain stuff and take your eye off the ball doing basics well - like checking a drain isn’t blocked or missing your t2 timing because your at a meeting about micro nutrients and biologicals!

I've done analysis where a field has severely under performed. Typically it comes back with deficiencies that relate to wet feet/poor rooting. i.e. compaction, poor drainage, poor soil structure, poor establishment etc, which we will have already identified.

 

[ajd132]

I've done analysis where a field has severely under performed. Typically it comes back with deficiencies that relate to wet feet/poor rooting. i.e. compaction, poor drainage, poor soil structure, poor establishment etc, which we will have already identified.

Yeh exactly, get the basics right. I’ve done exactly the same with the same conclusions.
Ditches, drains, look after soil, don’t maul about in the wet etc.

 

[Grass And Grain]

I think same as others. Could try to get lots of little improvements, 1% here, 1% there, and theoretically they could add up to 10%.

In reality, it's the big things which make the difference. e.g. plenty of cultivation/ drilling capacity to get most of acres done in timely manner, spreading tonnes of FYM more use than fiddling about with a few micronutrients, get rotation right, etc.

End of the day, as long as we're doing 95% of best job we can, the season and weather pattern have the biggest effect on yield.

Not frightened to have plenty of tractor and combine capacity. Consultant would tell me I've too much hp, but I recon it pays hands down with short and difficult weather windows.

 

[ajd132]

I think same as others. Could try to get lots of little improvements, 1% here, 1% there, and theoretically they could add up to 10%.

In reality, it's the big things which make the difference. e.g. plenty of cultivation/ drilling capacity to get most of acres done in timely manner, spreading tonnes of FYM more use than fiddling about with a few micronutrients, get rotation right, etc.

End of the day, as long as we're doing 95% of best job we can, the season and weather pattern have the biggest effect on yield.

Not frightened to have plenty of tractor and combine capacity. Consultant would tell me I've too much hp, but I recon it pays hands down with short and difficult weather windows.

Marginal gains are fine if they don’t take up too much time/eye off the ball and all the big gains are in place. I’m finding there is always room for improvement in the big gains though!

 

[An Gof]

Have three years data from this now. Haven’t really drawn any strong conclusions other than seasonality can appear to have a big impact.
Might have a dabble with some changes this spring.
2021 results showed dramatic Mn shortages in this area amongst a group of us using the system. Never got to the bottom of why? We were all using Mn and all experienced in identifying in crop deficiency symptoms. We saw nothing but the shortfall in the final
Reports was considerable.
I think it’s a useful and Interesting tool but the analysis and Interpretation of the results is somewhat lacking and diminishes the value which should be gained.

 

[T Hectares]

I’ve just gone back to dolloping chicken muck or sludge on where I can rather than getting all hung up on this stuff.

but I agree if anything is massively wrong it should be obvious to you before doing all this stuff.

I have the same approach
last year with the dry April/May a lot of WW yield was won or lost on N timing and SB yield on drilling date
Tinkering about with micro’s and bio’s is kind of peeing in the wind if the fundamentals aren’t right !

 

[ollie989898]

I’ve just gone back to dolloping chicken muck or sludge on where I can rather than getting all hung up on this stuff.

but I agree if anything is massively wrong it should be obvious to you before doing all this stuff.

Sludge/muck etc will cover a multitude of sins. Would be far better to direct efforts at this (along with cover crops, green manures and the like) I would venture.

 

[Wigeon]

On a vaguely related topic, how useful to people find the farmbench exercise?

It used to be free, and Included a nice breakfast and a warm feeling inside from knowing I was there or thereabouts on most things. Not sure it has made me more money though.

Local organisers want £450 for the privilege now. Not sure it's worth it.

 

[ajd132]

On a vaguely related topic, how useful to people find the farmbench exercise?

It used to be free, and Included a nice breakfast and a warm feeling inside from knowing I was there or thereabouts on most things. Not sure it has made me more money though.

Local organisers want £450 for the privilege now. Not sure it's worth it.

Benchmarking is sometimes useful but it’s really hard to compare differs businesses. It’s probably most beneficial to those who are completely out of touch with their costs but then they are unlikely to actually attend anything like this and probably living in cloud cuckoo land.

 

[SilliamWhale]

On a vaguely related topic, how useful to people find the farmbench exercise?

It used to be free, and Included a nice breakfast and a warm feeling inside from knowing I was there or thereabouts on most things. Not sure it has made me more money though.

Local organisers want £450 for the privilege now. Not sure it's worth it.

I've never been that fussed on benchmarking because I'm not that fussed on comparing fixed costs. I do enjoy the challenge of growing crops at the lowest possible price so I do like to know what everyone else is paying for their inputs etc though.

 

[Hindsight]

Benchmarking is sometimes useful but it’s really hard to compare differs businesses. It’s probably most beneficial to those who are completely out of touch with their costs but then they are unlikely to actually attend anything like this and probably living in cloud cuckoo land.

First thing to ask and to know is if the data is 'clean'. I am generally wary of data taken from crop recording programmes unless I know the coding, allocation, stock control etc is correct. And the yield data plugged in against the costs.

 

[An Gof]

On a vaguely related topic, how useful to people find the farmbench exercise?

It used to be free, and Included a nice breakfast and a warm feeling inside from knowing I was there or thereabouts on most things. Not sure it has made me more money though.

Local organisers want £450 for the privilege now. Not sure it's worth it.

Still free as far as I know. We have our group feedback session at the end of the month with AHDB. Wonder if we are about to get a shock.
We are formed as an AHDB business group. Are you being charged because some fancy consultant is running your group and now wants to bleed you of cash? You have paid the levy for the service should still be available. Im sure your group can arrange facilitation without having to pay Mr Mustard Trousers £450

 

[ajd132]

Still free as far as I know. We have our group feedback session at the end of the month with AHDB. Wonder if we are about to get a shock.
We are formed as an AHDB business group. Are you being charged because some fancy consultant is running your group and now wants to bleed you of cash? You have paid the levy for the service should still be available. Im sure your group can arrange facilitation without having to pay Mr Mustard Trousers £450

I wouldn’t pay £450 for someone to facilitate benchmarking. All the data you need to make sure you aren’t completely useless is out there for free!

 

[snarling bee]

Not frightened to have plenty of tractor and combine capacity.

I agree, especially with energy prices for drying grain.

We had various grain samples tested and we were low on P. But every sample was low in P irrespective of FYM or sewage cake application, or soil indices.

Recently watched an analysis and interpretation of farmers submitted crop data. What a joke. For eg, N inputs to milling wheat varied from minus, yes minus, 50kg N to [plus] 600 kg N applied. There was still no correlation to yield or protein.