AB15 topping for blackgrass.

[penfold]

Hello all,
Apologies if this has already been covered but we are currently topping our AB15 areas for blackgrass as it comes into full flower. First year and not the greatest establishment but must say the legumes, especially the clover, has really motored in the last few weeks. My question is how short should I cut it. Just low enough to take the heads off or go down much harder to promote the growth of what should be growing in there. Have heard horror stories of promoting prostrate blackgrass buy going low. Expecting to go over again so could go lower next time. This is the first time for us with ab15 and judging on my experience so far it will likely be the last!

 

[richard hammond]

Hello all,
Apologies if this has already been covered but we are currently topping our AB15 areas for blackgrass as it comes into full flower. First year and not the greatest establishment but must say the legumes, especially the clover, has really motored in the last few weeks. My question is how short should I cut it. Just low enough to take the heads off or go down much harder to promote the growth of what should be growing in there. Have heard horror stories of promoting prostrate blackgrass buy going low. Expecting to go over again so could go lower next time. This is the first time for us with ab15 and judging in my experience so far it will likely bet the last!

Just take the heads off, but be aware it will try and head again very quickly so you may need to re-top, but it is my opinion that non of these scheme elements will decrease any BG burden they just make you think they will, remember BG /Ryegrass are both genetically capable of surviving what ever we throw at them!(thats why they are a problem,)

 

[penfold]

Thank you. Yep fully expecting to go through again. Indeed. Not looking like I’ll be ab5ing again!

 

[BenAdamsAgri]

Top as tall as possible to just take the heads off. Otherwise it will head and inch off the ground next time and you won’t get it

 

[Banana Bar]

Just take the heads off, but be aware it will try and head again very quickly so you may need to re-top, but it is my opinion that non of these scheme elements will decrease any BG burden they just make you think they will, remember BG /Ryegrass are both genetically capable of surviving what ever we throw at them!(thats why they are a problem,)

Not AB15 but, I rented a 6.5ha next door to the farm from an old lady last September, I don’t really want it but shes a massive supporter of farming and I thought I was doing her a favour. The field has had Lucerne on it for 7 years, been cut and baled at least twice a year and grazed hard with sheep / lambs over the winter every year. It is thick with blackgrass in patches in its first cereal crop in at least 8 years! Bloody stuff should not be there now surely?

 

[DrWazzock]

I’ve been hand roguing BG out of wheat. Doable until my back went but hopefully I’ll be back at it before it sets seed. It’s noticeable there’s more getting a hold under overhanging trees. I wonder if the seed sticks to birds feet then washes off the branches onto the soil. It’s also obvious that topping won’t get it all as the heads you see are just a few of what’s sprawling about down in the wheat canopy. You get your hand round the plant at ground level and the size of the plant and number of tillers is something to behold. With topping I’d want it front mounted and cutting and lifting from very low so you aren’t running it down with the tractor wheels and you are lifting those prostrate tillers.
Good luck trying to stop it with topping. You’ll need it. I’m not really winning either but trying.

 

[B'o'B]

I’ve been hand roguing BG out of wheat. Doable until my back went but hopefully I’ll be back at it before it sets seed. It’s noticeable there’s more getting a hold under overhanging trees. I wonder if the seed sticks to birds feet then washes off the branches onto the soil. It’s also obvious that topping won’t get it all as the heads you see are just a few of what’s sprawling about down in the wheat canopy. You get your hand round the plant at ground level and the size of the plant and number of tillers is something to behold. With topping I’d want it front mounted and cutting and lifting from very low so you aren’t running it down with the tractor wheels and you are lifting those prostrate tillers.
Good luck trying to stop it with topping. You’ll need it. I’m not really winning either but trying.

Knapsack sprayer saves both time and back!
I’ve upgraded the process further with this….

electric moped with stabilizer which fits the tramlines

Wildlife definitely move a significant amount of it about

 

[yellow belly]

When bg is flowered cutting before seeds set and fill is effective
seeds take longer to fill than most people presume

cutting too early before flowering just promotes more tillers once the plant has fertilised it goes from vegetative to grain fill

currently here bg heads had no seed that had filled last week we are often a week later than many places

cutting in late April early may as many do on ab15 will lead to retillering here

 

[tr250]

Not AB15 but, I rented a 6.5ha next door to the farm from an old lady last September, I don’t really want it but shes a massive supporter of farming and I thought I was doing her a favour. The field has had Lucerne on it for 7 years, been cut and baled at least twice a year and grazed hard with sheep / lambs over the winter every year. It is thick with blackgrass in patches in its first cereal crop in at least 8 years! Bloody stuff should not be there now surely?

I’ve seen a field of Lucerne like that cut twice the bg loved it plenty of space and seeded every year

 

[Flat 10]

There’s a many many page thread on ab15 elsewhere on the forum, I think in the subs section. My experience is as follows, first autumn establishment was poor, partly due to pigeons, and full of rubbish. Spring time thought I was going to pull up and reseed but topped and it started to motor. Topped 3 or 4 more times and BG didn’t seed but clover did and I was feeling rather smug finally. Lots of clover seedlings in the autumn. Topped as directed in the spring at the end of March now bloody stuff is full of BG

 

[Hindsight]

There’s a many many page thread on ab15 elsewhere on the forum, I think in the subs section. My experience is as follows, first autumn establishment was poor, partly due to pigeons, and full of rubbish. Spring time thought I was going to pull up and reseed but topped and it started to motor. Topped 3 or 4 more times and BG didn’t seed but clover did and I was feeling rather smug finally. Lots of clover seedlings in the autumn. Topped as directed in the spring at the end of March now bloody stuff is full of BG

That's par from what I have seen. Needs grazing or silaging. Defra experts can try as they might cannot do different to proper agriculture. Sermon over.

 

[Flat 10]

That's par from what I have seen. Needs grazing or silaging. Defra experts can try as they might cannot do different to proper agriculture. Sermon over.

To be fair I’ve quite a bit of BG in all my other crops

 

[Will0]

Cleanest field for Blackgrass here was the first drilled, no pre em, after AB15.

I thought it would be worse than it is, YMMV

 

[Brisel]

Cleanest field for Blackgrass here was the first drilled, no pre em, after AB15.

I thought it would be worse than it is, YMMV

I've had a similar experience on heavy land after AB15. The land was ploughed though, more due to the roots of the legume ley than any plans - it just pulled up in huge knitted together lumps with a Topdown. Stonking yield of wheat too.

 

[yellow belly]

There’s a many many page thread on ab15 elsewhere on the forum, I think in the subs section. My experience is as follows, first autumn establishment was poor, partly due to pigeons, and full of rubbish. Spring time thought I was going to pull up and reseed but topped and it started to motor. Topped 3 or 4 more times and BG didn’t seed but clover did and I was feeling rather smug finally. Lots of clover seedlings in the autumn. Topped as directed in the spring at the end of March now bloody stuff is full of BG

Topped too early
Wait till end of April or early may before the ground nesting birds start sitting
Especially in a cold spring
Birds start nesting later in cold springs

 

[Will 1594]

Topped too early
Wait till end of April or early may before the ground nesting birds start sitting
Especially in a cold spring
Birds start nesting later in cold springs

how many birds will be destroyed with all this topping

 

[Flat 10]

Topped too early
Wait till end of April or early may before the ground nesting birds start sitting
Especially in a cold spring
Birds start nesting later in cold springs

Following guidance

 

[yellow belly]

how many birds will be destroyed with all this topping

not that many
round here the heavy rain on the 23 may washed out most ground nesting birds and newly born leverates
this and the cold april has not done leverates any favours
we have plenty of adult hares but not many leverates