Ford Bridgend plant under threat

[Roger Perry]

Depends on how good your accountant is. Theoretically the top rate is 45%, but nobody will be paying that on anything meaningful.

£80k top line would give you £25k tax bill (but no need for private medical, etc.)

That's direct taxation.........right.
If you throw in all the other taxes, VAT, property taxes etc would that bring you over 50%..?

 

[robs1]

I expect if you compare how much of average income it takes to pay for an"average" life country by country it would be pretty similar, countries tax in different ways but the total you pay to get the services you need arent much different

 

[Highland Mule]

That's direct taxation.........right.
If you throw in all the other taxes, VAT, property taxes etc would that bring you over 50%..?

Property tax - around £1-2k/year for an average house
VAT - 20% on 'luxuries' (most stuff).
Insurance tax - 5% on premia
Car - anything from £0 - £500/year, depending on model, age etc. (some will be more than this, but they are exceptions)
Oh, and I forgot National Insurance - employers and employees.

As a business owner, the objective is to get as much expense onto the company and hence paid before income tax. If you're a (ltd) company owner, the extra challenge is to get income as share dividend and avoid national insurance. I do the latter, and my taxation will be nowhere near 50%.

 

[robs1]

Property tax - around £1-2k/year for an average house
VAT - 20% on 'luxuries' (most stuff).
Insurance tax - 5% on premia
Car - anything from £0 - £500/year, depending on model, age etc. (some will be more than this, but they are exceptions)
Oh, and I forgot National Insurance - employers and employees.

As a business owner, the objective is to get as much expense onto the company and hence paid before income tax. If you're a (ltd) company owner, the extra challenge is to get income as share dividend and avoid national insurance. I do the latter, and my taxation will be nowhere near 50%.

I bet if you add it all up you would be horrified.

 

[Highland Mule]

I bet if you add it all up you would be horrified.

I know how much I stick into savings, and that's pretty close to 50%, before I look at the 'stuff' I have.

 

[Pasty]

I don't blame anyone for trying to save tax. It's perfectly sensible.

 

[br jones]

Its not just income tax for the mere mortal though. There's 20% VAT on most things apart from food and a few essentials. There's fuel tax. There's road duty on driving cars. There's a massive extra tax on buying new cars with the VAT added on top. All of this after paying income tax. Oh and insurance tax on insuring stuff. Tax on selling and buying property and Rates on living in it. National Insurance.

The list just goes on and on and on. I wouldn't be surprised if most ordinary people don't end up paying between 60 and 80% tax on their income and expenditure overall in one way or another.

You forgot ,your taxed when you die

 

[Highland Mule]

You forgot ,your taxed when you die

You aren't. Your successors may have to pay tax on the unearned income you leave them, if you're not clever enough to plan ahead.

 

[Cowabunga]

You aren't. Your successors may have to pay tax on the unearned income you leave them, if you're not clever enough to plan ahead.

Ah but it was earned and taxed at least once already.
Agree about the planning though. Many don't.

 

[Pasty]

Ah but it was earned and taxed at least once already.
Agree about the planning though. Many don't.

My parents were wise enough to sort planning well in time. Unfortunately both my brother and are either divorced or about to be. Think I would rather have paid a little tax.........

 

[Highland Mule]

Ah but it was earned and taxed at least once already.
Agree about the planning though. Many don't.

I aim to get as much as I can of my lifetime earnings into my pocket without paying tax on them. I'm cramming as much as I can into my pension fund, then will draw out as much as I can as a lump sum as early as I can, followed by annual drawings at the tax threshold.

 

[Cowabunga]

My parents were wise enough to sort planning well in time. Unfortunately both my brother and are either divorced or about to be. Think I would rather have paid a little tax.........

Are you saying that the tax would have saved their marriages?

 

[Pasty]

Are you saying that the tax would have saved their marriages?

No, just that if you are the one in a marriage who owns all the assets because your parents were forward thinking then you should consider that you might lose half of it in a divorce, regardless of whose fault it was.

 

[Cowabunga]

No, just that if you are the one in a marriage who owns all the assets because your parents were forward thinking then you should consider that you might lose half of it in a divorce, regardless of whose fault it was.

Well, yes, I can see that. But even if you had to have paid death duties, you would still lose half of what's left, except that both parties would be poorer at the end of it than otherwise.

Moral of story is to plan well ahead for both succession and marriage and work on the marriage part especially.

 

[Pasty]

Well, yes, I can see that. But even if you had to have paid death duties, you would still lose half of what's left, except that both parties would be poorer at the end of it than otherwise.

Moral of story is to plan well ahead for both succession and marriage and work on the marriage part especially.

We wouldn't have as my parents transferred the assets to us in the correct way with lots of advice. As for marriage, it was a long, long time ago and I was, young, stupid and trusting. In fact, I would advise any male to avoid the concept altogether.

 

[smallholder99]

Its not just income tax for the mere mortal though. There's 20% VAT on most things apart from food and a few essentials. There's fuel tax. There's road duty on driving cars. There's a massive extra tax on buying new cars with the VAT added on top. All of this after paying income tax. Oh and insurance tax on insuring stuff. Tax on selling and buying property and Rates on living in it. National Insurance.

The list just goes on and on and on. I wouldn't be surprised if most ordinary people don't end up paying between 60 and 80% tax on their income and expenditure overall in one way or another.

i saw afigure somewhere that uk govt total income from tax etc worked out at over £12k/person, does that sound like value for money

 

[smallholder99]

and as for ford bridgend ,they had £100k/worker of govt subsidies to become more efficient, the plant assembled an average of 3 to 4 engines per worker per day so labour wouldnt be much over £50 per engine which isnt much considering the price of the cars

 

[Cowabunga]

i saw afigure somewhere that uk govt total income from tax etc worked out at over £12k/person, does that sound like value for money

That's way on the low side. My cowman's income tax and national insurance works out at way more than that. Plus he pays all his VAT and council tax and fuel tax and all the other taxes people pay from day to day on top. It adds up to a horrendous amount per working person. Of course the average takes account of all the others on benefits of one kind or another I suppose, which must lower the average substantially come to think of it.

 

[smallholder99]

That's way on the low side. My cowman's income tax and national insurance works out at way more than that. Plus he pays all his VAT and council tax and fuel tax and all the other taxes people pay from day to day on top. It adds up to a horrendous amount per working person. Of course the average takes account of all the others on benefits of one kind or another I suppose, which must lower the average substantially come to think of it.

say £12k each times 66 odd million people= about £800 billion a year

 

[Cowabunga]

say £12k each times 66 odd million people= about £800 billion a year

Public spending was projected to be just over 900 billion this year, so that sounds about right. Unfortunately public spending is likely to massively exceed the forecast due to you know what.