- Location
- Fife
Pick something that suits your system.
Texel would add shape but could reduce scan. Maybe bigger than your current ewes as well.
For maternal line, what are you hoping to add on r next cross?
suffolk or charollais for lleyn
- Thread starter BigSteve
- Start date
Texel would add shape but could reduce scan. Maybe bigger than your current ewes as well.
For maternal line, what are you hoping to add on r next cross?
Probably easyram texel. Flock ewes over 3 crop are Tex X but could do with a bit of % inc+ from c. 165%.
BFL
ringi
Member
Can you say who this is, and how it is going?
- Location
- Montgomeryshire
easyram1
Member
- Location
- North Shropshire
Our NZ Texel flock ( approx 450 ewes) scan regularly 190%-195%.
easyram1
Member
- Location
- North Shropshire
We did a bit of testing a few years ago. Last year included in our importation were 3 GDF 9 carriers and we have have ram lambs on the ground now and available for sale this autumn sired by these rams
Not my place to say who it is, but it's going well enough for him that I'm having to think about somewhere else to source replacements as his % shedders goes up.
UPDATE (I was the OP): We went with Charollais rams over our Lleyn ewes.
We put pure Charolais rams over the Lleyn B flock ewes.
Lleyn rams over the Lleyn A flock ewes.
Interesting results.....thought you might like if I share....
I've tried to make it a fair test , by comparing wethers with wethers. We lamb indoors, after lambing no ewes gate cake, no lambs get creep. Every outfit gets rotated on the same pasture, grouped according to date of birth.
Our B flock ewes are generally of lower standard (bit smaller, some with low-grade issues), so it isn't a perfectly fair test; you'd expect B flock wethers to perform a bit worse if they had the same rams as the A flock.
Despite the B flock ewes being lower standard, no one would be surprised to hear that the char x wethers off the B flock performed better.
But the extent of the difference was really surprising:
scanning rates were almost exactly the same
lamb losses were fairly similar (A flock 5% better)
rearing costs per ewe were the same
ewe losses/culls (mastitis/culls for feet etc) were the same
90% of the B flock wethers were sold by early July.
At this point zero of the A flock wethers had been sold.
Almost 8 weeks later we have sold about half the A flock wethers, the B flock wethers are all gone.
Owing to the earlier sale , average price for B flock wethers was 24% ppk higher . Plus there will be further financial advantages for getting them off farm sooner
Impressive difference.
But now....tempting though it is to retain charxlleyn ewelambs as replacements, would I start seeing a reduction in some of the performance figures of the maternal flock (lamb losses, scanning rates, ewe losses/culls). The nice thing about the char rams as B flock sires has been that the B flock ewes have performed just as well as the A flock ewes in every other area (lamb losses, scanning rates, ewe losses/culls), becasue the B flock ewes are maternal lleyn.
More difficult to quantify, isn't it? Thoughts please....
We put pure Charolais rams over the Lleyn B flock ewes.
Lleyn rams over the Lleyn A flock ewes.
Interesting results.....thought you might like if I share....
I've tried to make it a fair test , by comparing wethers with wethers. We lamb indoors, after lambing no ewes gate cake, no lambs get creep. Every outfit gets rotated on the same pasture, grouped according to date of birth.
Our B flock ewes are generally of lower standard (bit smaller, some with low-grade issues), so it isn't a perfectly fair test; you'd expect B flock wethers to perform a bit worse if they had the same rams as the A flock.
Despite the B flock ewes being lower standard, no one would be surprised to hear that the char x wethers off the B flock performed better.
But the extent of the difference was really surprising:
scanning rates were almost exactly the same
lamb losses were fairly similar (A flock 5% better)
rearing costs per ewe were the same
ewe losses/culls (mastitis/culls for feet etc) were the same
90% of the B flock wethers were sold by early July.
At this point zero of the A flock wethers had been sold.
Almost 8 weeks later we have sold about half the A flock wethers, the B flock wethers are all gone.
Owing to the earlier sale , average price for B flock wethers was 24% ppk higher . Plus there will be further financial advantages for getting them off farm sooner
Impressive difference.
But now....tempting though it is to retain charxlleyn ewelambs as replacements, would I start seeing a reduction in some of the performance figures of the maternal flock (lamb losses, scanning rates, ewe losses/culls). The nice thing about the char rams as B flock sires has been that the B flock ewes have performed just as well as the A flock ewes in every other area (lamb losses, scanning rates, ewe losses/culls), becasue the B flock ewes are maternal lleyn.
More difficult to quantify, isn't it? Thoughts please....
M-J-G
Member
I'd stick with your Lleyn ewes, your Char lambs are only doing as well as their mothers will rear them.
I kept CharX ewes in the 90s and I'd consider stopping keeping sheep before I'd have them again.
Last edited:
- Location
- Montgomeryshire
First off, I’m not at all surprised by the difference in performance, which ultimately you should see from any decent terminal sire, or why bother using one?
As to keeping Charollais crosses, I have done so out of my Highlander ewes when I’ve been short on females. The crossbred ewes are bigger (higher maintenance cost but higher cull value) and slightly poorer on maternal ability and milk. Putting a Charollais back on them, they produce cracking lambs, but are a touch softer at birth. Ewes will also be stronger and wilder to work with.
I wouldn’t bother keeping them unless you have no option. I only did it as everything here is Mv, so my options to purchase replacements are limited (& I don’t want Lleyns).
- Location
- North Antrim
Stick to what you are doing, that will be as good as it gets. Never ever keep charollais cross as commercial ewes, some of them will be fine but big picture it will be a backwards step.
- Location
- Mendips Somerset
not surprised at your results , one of my customers run lleyns ,splits flock same as you , over mainly red clover leys (dairy) had very similar results , 300 ewes used 1.5T cake over lambing , no creep , first lambs away at 10 weeks ,runs own butcher shop so is well on top of carcase composition fat levels etc , Lambs not over big and kills at 40kg ,so better selling carcase cuts , (big lambs make expensive cuts for customers ), charollais high growth rates + shape , lleyn maternal traits with lower maintainance requirement , would keep the recipy the same if it works , your getting a lot of hybrid vigour which will help as well
pauld
Member
- Location
- Pershore Worcestershire
You say the B flock is of lesser quality, but is this just because they are milkier and have had a harder time. This would explain why their lambs go quicker.
- Location
- North Antrim
We have to assume that the man knows his own sheep.
No, they're in the B flock for offences (bad feet, broken mouth, had to pull lambs, smaller lambs last time). So they're worse sheep
ringi
Member
Not if the output is weighed at 8 weeks and at least basic proformance recording is done as higher lamb weight at 8 weeks (compared to ewe weight) gives an ewe a much better proformance number.
- Location
- Fife
