Coming soon to a Barbeque near you............

[Purli R]

Lot of folks missing the point. If it's in him, it's in him. You did the right thing. Vendor and auctioneer did/doing the wrong thing.

NBA Warranty very vague regarding temperament or lack of it,not alot H&H can do really afaics

 

[betweenthelines]

Quite possible that having 3 strange bulls in the vicinity he was trying to prove his dominance.

There's quite a range of views on here, I'd like to know what the breeder has to say.

But having been found guilty without trial, as it were, I can understand why he might not want to comment

 

[GenuineRisk]

I had a bull the same deliverd and in pen on his own was truly scary put him in with two cull cows and nicest bull you would ever meet. USE YOUR NODDLE MAN ITS STOCKMAN SHIP NOT ROCKET SCIENCE.

You're surely missing a massive point here - what is the other major key trait of a British or `Belgian Blue, other than the double muscling ? I’ll enlighten you, as you obviously are missing it. It’s TEMPERAMENT. I’ve put it in upper case for you just so you don't miss it. Whatever the reason that caused the bull in question to flip, we’ll never know but it isn’t acceptable and you don’t breed from animals displaying an exception to the recognised standard docile nature of the BB in our book. It’s rare indeed to find a truly nasty Blue bull but it happens. Maybe he was OK back home but the move triggered or exacerbated a problem in this bull‘s head and he chooses to act aggressively, rather that respect the stockman’s space. There is only one way he should go and now has. I am very surprised reparation hasn’t been made. Don’t know the breeder personally but know one or two who have purchased from him and bred quality stock. I would have thought it sensible to have taken the bull back and repaid in full or at least made up the difference in the kill price and what was paid. Which is what we would have done, as being high health we don’t take bulls back here - they would go for slaughter.

@Purli R - can we interest you in a very good blue and white, tall, long bull we currently have for sale? Gorgeous temperamemt, shown last year once successfully. Half brother to Burke Trophy winning bull that’s been working well for past two years ?

 

[Sharpy]

If the breeder was sure the bull was of reasonable temperament he would surely have taken it back or given some help? Basically saying tough sh!t its yours now shows he knew that there was an issue.

 

[John Chance]

NBA Warranty very vague regarding temperament or lack of it,not alot H&H can do really afaics

H&H can do a great deal IMHO. They have leverage with the breeder that you do not. They should be piling the pressure on him to do the right thing. And sharpish.

 

[Treecreeper]

Im not up on what the terms and conditions are on the sale of bulls, but surely temperament is one thing that is discussed. Surely if a bull cannot be handled safely, maybe a scoring should be given, so a docile Aberdeen or Whitehead maybe a 1, a flightly bull a 5, but anything not really manageable, 6-10; 10 requiring a bullet.? Having a gentlemans agreement that a bull is grand, is too open to abuse. And I agree, a bull can change too; but surely if a bull moves up the scale I have given, then the deal needs to be reviewed?? Also what period of time is acceptable. I have seen bulls on our farm, that were grand when they were young, just turn pure mental once they matured. So surely there has to be a period of time where the bull is allowed to settle in?????
[/QUOT

I believe docility is part of the EBV scoring with lims.

These bulls that are fed for 500 day weight performance get to a point when they need work, that generally calms them down however there are always exceptions.

 

[Purli R]

This is strange, a guy not too far from us bought a blue bull from Skipton.all done over the phone an pictures I guess due to lock down.anyway, they met half way an exchanged.the bull was tied in the trailer so once in his trailer also tied him up didn't think much of it.once he got home , dropped the tail gate went in to un-tie him.next thing the bull flips an pinned him in the corner.gave the lad a proper going over was only saved by a bar at the front.
Seemingly he's having the same issues as you, won't give him money back.reading your issue I wondered if it was the same breeder?

Well it"s nothing to do with us,not being rude but have you got the right story.As a yorkshire bred bull sold online thru carlisle did something similar in the trailer etc.However that vendor took the bull back as he knew it was right,dont know if vendor refunded money or H&H did but it"s been sorted.

 

[Purli R]

You're surely missing a massive point here - what is the other major key trait of a British or `Belgian Blue, other than the double muscling ? I’ll enlighten you, as you obviously are missing it. It’s TEMPERAMENT. I’ve put it in upper case for you just so you don't miss it. Whatever the reason that caused the bull in question to flip, we’ll never know but it isn’t acceptable and you don’t breed from animals displaying an exception to the recognised standard docile nature of the BB in our book. It’s rare indeed to find a truly nasty Blue bull but it happens. Maybe he was OK back home but the move triggered or exacerbated a problem in this bull‘s head and he chooses to act aggressively, rather that respect the stockman’s space. There is only one way he should go and now has. I am very surprised reparation hasn’t been made. Don’t know the breeder personally but know one or two who have purchased from him and bred quality stock. I would have thought it sensible to have taken the bull back and repaid in full or at least made up the difference in the kill price and what was paid. Which is what we would have done, as being high health we don’t take bulls back here - they would go for slaughter.

@Purli R - can we interest you in a very good blue and white, tall, long bull we currently have for sale? Gorgeous temperamemt, shown last year once successfully. Half brother to Burke Trophy winning bull that’s been working well for past two years ?

Plenty of Top stockmen on here,do this,do that, do as I say.Does anyone else now realise why farming has such a high accident rate with such Gung -ho attitudes,Definately 2 camps on this thread. You tb1?

 

[Purli R]

I think this thread reiterates why I will never buy anything especially a bull or a tup via online or video sales...there’s nothing like seeing and handling them in the flesh

In normal times we wouldn"t buy anything "important" online. Only bought it cos it had alledgedly a low birth weight& short gestation & definately a good set of balls,fair enough we knew it might have been a complete twit when it turned up.

 

[GenuineRisk]

Plenty of Top stockmen on here,do this,do that, do as I say.Does anyone else now realise why farming has such a high accident rate with such Gung -ho attitudes,Definately 2 camps on this thread. You tb1?

yep but CHeCs accredited 10 !

 

[Optimus]

Well it"s nothing to do with us,not being rude but have you got the right story.As a yorkshire bred bull sold online thru carlisle did something similar in the trailer etc.However that vendor took the bull back as he knew it was right,dont know if vendor refunded money or H&H did but it"s been sorted.

At the time it would of been right as my brother was in foot trimming for the guy .as said it was a few weeks ago now and I never asked him what the outcome was.

 

[Optimus]

Well it"s nothing to do with us,not being rude but have you got the right story.As a yorkshire bred bull sold online thru carlisle did something similar in the trailer etc.However that vendor took the bull back as he knew it was right,dont know if vendor refunded money or H&H did but it"s been sorted.

At the time it would of been right as my brother was in foot trimming for the guy .as said it was a few weeks ago now and I never asked him what the outcome was.

 

[Hilly]

You're surely missing a massive point here - what is the other major key trait of a British or `Belgian Blue, other than the double muscling ? I’ll enlighten you, as you obviously are missing it. It’s TEMPERAMENT. I’ve put it in upper case for you just so you don't miss it. Whatever the reason that caused the bull in question to flip, we’ll never know but it isn’t acceptable and you don’t breed from animals displaying an exception to the recognised standard docile nature of the BB in our book. It’s rare indeed to find a truly nasty Blue bull but it happens. Maybe he was OK back home but the move triggered or exacerbated a problem in this bull‘s head and he chooses to act aggressively, rather that respect the stockman’s space. There is only one way he should go and now has. I am very surprised reparation hasn’t been made. Don’t know the breeder personally but know one or two who have purchased from him and bred quality stock. I would have thought it sensible to have taken the bull back and repaid in full or at least made up the difference in the kill price and what was paid. Which is what we would have done, as being high health we don’t
@Purli R - can we interest you in a very good blue and white, tall, long bull we currently have for sale? Gorgeous temperamemt, shown last year once successfully. Half brother to Burke Trophy winning bull that’s been working well for past two years ?

The point your missing is the bull ain’t been given a chance nor the vendor he might just be a bit upset new home on his own he needs to be given a little chance to prove this is or is not the case before rash things like killing him and slandering the vendor , give the animal a
Chance after that by all
Means get rid of proves a wrong un .

 

[GenuineRisk]

The point your missing is the bull ain’t been given a chance nor the vendor he might just be a bit upset new home on his own he needs to be given a little chance to prove this is or is not the case before rash things like killing him and slandering the vendor , give the animal a
Chance after that by all
Means get rid of proves a wrong un .

but it’s been three weeks hasn’t it? Plenty of time to settle an upset animal imo.

Purchaser has a right to expect a decent temperament on the animal he selected. Makes you wonder what the bull might have done had he been sold the usual way at the mart at Carlisle. Fact is, he’d have had to have passed the inspection and by the sound it, I would contend he probably wouldn’t and would have been spun by the inspection committee before the actual sale. So, theoretically, as that almost certainly would have been the case, the fact that the virtual element removed that selection criteria, I would actually say both vendor and H&H don‘t have a leg to stand on,

Pretty much like the bull doesn’t now either..

 

[jamesy]

I like to walk in amongst my cows. I’d rather not take the chance that I might have to run out the field as fast as Usain Bolt.

I had a very unpleasant experience with a cow in the spring that I have no wish ever to repeat. You did the correct thing in getting rid of bull. Yes, he may well have calmed down whilst out with cows.... he may also have kept you out of the field!

 

[goodevans]

The point your missing is the bull ain’t been given a chance nor the vendor he might just be a bit upset new home on his own he needs to be given a little chance to prove this is or is not the case before rash things like killing him and slandering the vendor , give the animal a
Chance after that by all
Means get rid of proves a wrong un .

The vendor did have a chance as said in opening post,he obviously new it was well sold even if he didnt know it had a temperament problem.@Purli R surely did the right thing as he alone knew how it was behaving on his farm,better a dead bull than a dead person

 

[Hilly]

The vendor did have a chance as said in opening post,he obviously new it was well sold even if he didnt know it had a temperament problem.@Purli R surely did the right thing as he alone knew how it was behaving on his farm,better a dead bull than a dead person

The vendor has video proof of it walking out quite happy on Facebook , how’s he to know that it was going to turn or maybe someone took cold feet after paying for it as so many farmers do these days then try to wriggle out.

 

[Bill dog]

I think you’re being too harsh @Hilly . The buyer buys a bull, it’s a feckwit of a thing . He is due some sort of re course from the seller, and the market should have the balls to deal with it.
Who’s to say the bull hadn’t been doped before the video anyway. Stranger things have happened!
The buyer is more than entitled to want to be safe amongst his stock , for his and his family’s sake !

 

[AGN76]

I dare say with the amount of bulls churned out under @Purli R 's prefix he might know a thing or two when it comes to bulls!

 

[Sid]

Imagine of this "fine when it left my farm" bull was put with some cows in a field with some cows on a public footpath. Who is liable then?