Lambs dying

[Sheep92]

I sold 140 lambs to a neighbour a week ago, he gave them a 3 in 1 bolus containing g iodine cobalt and selenium, the next day he had a dead one and 2 days after that lost a few more think 6 have died so far, we are both trying to figure out what the cause is I told him to get a PM done but he hasn't yet, he said the lambs that died so far suddenly look like they are pining away and have breathing problems, I dont think its pneumonia as I sold 150 of the same lambs to another man and he has no problems and I still have 1000 plus lambs here on farm and no losses,my thinking is its something to do with the bolus as it's the only different treatment his lambs got, I looked up stuff on the internet and found this, just wonder what do ye think the problem may be? Many thanks

 

[copse]

Has he damaged the lambs throat with bolus gun ?

 

[Sheep92]

Had he damaged the lambs throat with bolus gun ?

He may have, but says not, that was the first thing that I thought of

 

[exmoorromney]

I'd get a postmortem done ASAP and make sure they check the throat. We had a neighbour that lost 250 ewes that he had bolused, for some reason the boluses got stuck in the throat and blocked the airway, they never found out if it was an administering error or a dodgy batch of boluses but the symptoms were the same.

 

[neilo]

I sold 140 lambs to a neighbour a week ago, he gave them a 3 in 1 bolus containing g iodine cobalt and selenium, the next day he had a dead one and 2 days after that lost a few more think 6 have died so far, we are both trying to figure out what the cause is I told him to get a PM done but he hasn't yet, he said the lambs that died so far suddenly look like they are pining away and have breathing problems, I dont think its pneumonia as I sold 150 of the same lambs to another man and he has no problems and I still have 1000 plus lambs here on farm and no losses,my thinking is its something to do with the bolus as it's the only different treatment his lambs got, I looked up stuff on the internet and found this, just wonder what do ye think the problem may be? Many thanks

I can't imagine it could be selenium toxicity, unless he is feeding them with a lot as well. The Se from the bolus certainly wouldn't be released in a big hit within a few days anyway, that's the point of them.

My first thoughts would be an administration problem, or could stressing them with handling/moving farm have triggered a pasteurella outbreak? PM needed I would say, if only to absolve you of responsibility.

 

[Northeastfarmer]

I'd get a postmortem done ASAP and make sure they check the throat. We had a neighbour that lost 250 ewes that he had bolused, for some reason the boluses got stuck in the throat and blocked the airway, they never found out if it was an administering error or a dodgy batch of boluses but the symptoms were the same.

Lost 250 ewes

 

[Sheep92]

I'd get a postmortem done ASAP and make sure they check the throat. We had a neighbour that lost 250 ewes that he had bolused, for some reason the boluses got stuck in the throat and blocked the airway, they never found out if it was an administering error or a dodgy batch of boluses but the symptoms were the same.

I told him to get a PM done, think it's the only way personally, I'd be more worried if some of my lambs that have gone else where were getting the same problem but they havent

 

[Sheep92]

I can't imagine it could be selenium toxicity, unless he is feeding them with a lot as well. The Se from the bolus certainly wouldn't be released in a big hit within a few days anyway, that's the point of them.

My first thoughts would be an administration problem, or could stressing them with handling/moving farm have triggered a pasteurella outbreak? PM needed I would say, if only to absolve you of responsibility.

True, they're meant to be slow release, yea I thought about pasteurella, would the change in land cause an outbreak? Lambs are used to being handled and have been loaded on the truck before, luckily theres no soreness over the whole affair, I think I'm actually more annoyed than he is over it, if another diesel be pushing him to get a pm anyway

 

[neilo]

I told him to get a PM done, think it's the only way personally, I'd be more worried if some of my lambs that have gone else where were getting the same problem but they havent

Would it be worth offering to pay for a PM if he’s not keen to do it himself. If you regularly sell store lambs it won’t help you another year if someone happens to mention they had a bunch die out of a load from you. People tend to jump to conclusions and point fingers.

 

[exmoorromney]

Lost 250 ewes

Unfortunately yes, certainly put the frighteners on us for a bit and enough to stop us bolusing our ewes for a while even though we had never had a problem before. Was a very worrying time for him.

 

[Sheep92]

Would it be worth offering to pay for a PM if he’s not keen to do it himself. If you regularly sell store lambs it won’t help you another year if someone happens to mention they had a bunch die out of a load from you. People tend to jump to conclusions and point fingers.

Aye think I may, always like having repeat customers

 

[Bury the Trash]

Just a thought butdid the boluses contain copper? By mistake or otherwise ....and then if it were texel or x lambs

 

[hendrebc]

Sounds like pasteurella bought on by the stress of moving and/or a change in diet (even if it's very subtle change) to me. Hopefully it will stop once they settle and get used to the new feed and surroundings.
Just go over with your penknife and open the ribcage up the side of the brisket on one you can tell easy enough by checking the lungs if there is another one. They will be a dark red or purple colour instead of a salmon pink.

 

[Sheep92]

Just a thought butdid the boluses contain copper? By mistake or otherwise ....and then if it were texel or x lambs

No copper in them, it crossed my mind though!

 

[Sheep92]

Sounds like pasteurella bought on by the stress of moving and/or a change in diet (even if it's very subtle change) to me. Hopefully it will stop once they settle and get used to the new feed and surroundings.
Just go over with your penknife and open the ribcage up the side of the brisket on one you can tell easy enough by checking the lungs if there is another one. They will be a dark red or purple colour instead of a salmon pink.

Will do. Hopefully Theres always something with them

 

[Al R]

Ask him which way he boluses? I always aim it down the right hand side of the mouth from behind, just the same as tubing a lamb. over 15 years of doing 1000+ ewes and all their lambs we’ve never had deaths. This spring doing the pre lambing Bolus I noticed 1 of the staff wasn’t concentrating on which side she was putting them down, with that 2 ewes collapsed, gave 1 a Heinrich manoeuvre and she coughed it up and walked off, the other I couldn’t save but definitely taught us a lesson.

 

[neilo]

Just a thought butdid the boluses contain copper? By mistake or otherwise ....and then if it were texel or x lambs

I wouldn't have thought the 2g of copper oxide in a lamb bolus would kill anything very quickly, unless they'd already been teetering on the edge of toxicity. I give copper to my pure Beltex and all my other lambs other than the pedigree Charollais (which can also be prone to toxicity apparently) have a bit of Texel blood in too. All suffer if they don't have copper round here.

 

[Devil's advocate]

Lost 250 ewes

I've never used bolus, er I won't be doing now.

God that is awful, it would haunt me for years.

 

[exmoor dave]

Sounds like boluses getting stuck in the wrong place, not quite choking the lambs at first, til the bolus moves abit a day or two later.

 

[Sheep92]

Ask him which way he boluses? I always aim it down the right hand side of the mouth from behind, just the same as tubing a lamb. over 15 years of doing 1000+ ewes and all their lambs we’ve never had deaths. This spring doing the pre lambing Bolus I noticed 1 of the staff wasn’t concentrating on which side she was putting them down, with that 2 ewes collapsed, gave 1 a Heinrich manoeuvre and she coughed it up and walked off, the other I couldn’t save but definitely taught us a lesson.

Yea 2 staff of his did them, it has to be something to with it, same here I bolus 1200 ewes every year never had a ewe choke, these were 30 kg texel ewe lambs so be easier to injure them whilst doing it