Spring wheat vs. spring barley

[Serup]

How common is spring wheat in the UK?
In Denmark it is almost non existant.

I have to grow a lot of spring crops, because of cover crops.
I can use wheat to feed my cows. Barley we would rather not feed in these amounts.

My history with growing barley to malting specification, is not impressive. Feed barley for sale is not desireable, because of the economics associated with it.
So i was wondering how the costs, yields and obstacles of growing spring wheat is looking.

 

[Flat 10]

How common is spring wheat in the UK?
In Denmark it is almost non existant.

I have to grow a lot of spring crops, because of cover crops.
I can use wheat to feed my cows. Barley we would rather not feed in these amounts.

My history with growing barley to malting specification, is not impressive. Feed barley for sale is not desireable, because of the economics associated with it.
So i was wondering how the costs, yields and obstacles of growing spring wheat is looking.

Why don’t you feed barley? Surely it’s better than wheat? Not masses of spring wheat grown here either.

 

[Serup]

Why don’t you feed barley? Surely it’s better than wheat? Not masses of spring wheat grown here either.

I treat it with caustic soda - rolled grain is too hot in the amounts i use. And barley is too expensive to treat with soda.

 

[Flat 10]

I treat it with caustic soda - rolled grain is too hot in the amounts i use. And barley is too expensive to treat with soda.

Barley is worth more than wheat? In the uk there is a massive discount currently, ~£40/t or it costs more to treat barley than wheat?

 

[Serup]

Barley is worth more than wheat? In the uk there is a massive discount currently, ~£40/t or it costs more to treat barley than wheat?

This past year, barley has been priced significantly lower than wheat. Even malting barley is lower than wheat at the moment. Last harvest i could get 1030 DKr/ton for feed barley and 1270 DKr/ton of feed wheat. Malting premium has been between 50 and 150 DKr/ton i 2020 and for the comming season.

I can treat wheat (and rye) with 3% soda, barley need 5%. It cost almost 10£/ton for every percent.

 

[Flat 10]

Thank you. Sorry I wasn’t any help.

 

[EddieB]

I haven’t grown many crops of spring wheat, but the yields on my light land have always been disappointing. I have found that February drilled winter wheat has outperformed spring wheat. I still occasionally grow it on a seed contract if the premium is high enough. I don’t think that it’s a hugely popular crop here in the UK.

 

[Spencer]

How common is spring wheat in the UK?
In Denmark it is almost non existant.

I have to grow a lot of spring crops, because of cover crops.
I can use wheat to feed my cows. Barley we would rather not feed in these amounts.

My history with growing barley to malting specification, is not impressive. Feed barley for sale is not desireable, because of the economics associated with it.
So i was wondering how the costs, yields and obstacles of growing spring wheat is looking.

What other spring crops do you grow?

 

[Serup]

What other spring crops do you grow?

Maize for silage, sometimes peas if i drill grass in the spring.
Other than feed, barley had been my choise.
I can’t store anything for sale, so many crops are not an option.

 

[deleted user 837354]

Spring wheat needs to be in the ground as early as possible and done in reasonable conditions. It can get very leggy and require sensible PGR use. How it yields seemed to vary according to the season IMO.

 

[radar]

Biggest issue I've found in the past is ergot. Maybe less of a problem if using it yourself but mills do not like it at all.

 

[Spencer]

Maize for silage, sometimes peas if i drill grass in the spring.
Other than feed, barley had been my choise.
I can’t store anything for sale, so many crops are not an option.

Oats?

 

[deleted user 837354]

Biggest issue I've found in the past is ergot. Maybe less of a problem if using it yourself but mills do not like it at all.

Forgot to mention that though I never saw it but I was warned by the old hands it is known for it.

In my experience, the canopy was so lush and bold it used to get a lot of mildew for fun.

 

[Al R]

Spring wheat needs to be in the ground as early as possible and done in reasonable conditions. It can get very leggy and require sensible PGR use. How it yields seemed to vary according to the season IMO.

I’ve put spring wheat in up to mid April before and it was still better than WW, al be it late September combining but it did have everything including the kitchen sink thrown at it every year.
Sow it thick if March/April sowing, 250kg/ha ideally as it doesn’t tiller the same as WW. 2-3 doses of N - or up to your maximum allowed then. I used to grow a few hundred acres every year, never got drilling until mid-late March at the earliest

 

[deleted user 837354]

I’ve put spring wheat in up to mid April before and it was still better than WW, al be it late September combining but it did have everything including the kitchen sink thrown at it every year.
Sow it thick if March/April sowing, 250kg/ha ideally as it doesn’t tiller the same as WW. 2-3 doses of N - or up to your maximum allowed then. I used to grow a few hundred acres every year, never got drilling until mid-late March at the earliest

Fair play to you, all the times I have seen spring wheat later than about the middle of March around here it has been poor- the dry weather sets in and you just see it staggering from one growth stage to the next. Done earlier, the root system is a lot more extensive and it seems better able to deal with dry summer months? This is why I always said to customers you need to be getting on with it and the old hands used to chuckle that I had customers who rarely, if ever, got it drilled in February.

I agree it needs a high seed rate and a sensible N and fungicide regime, it's not a one spray wonder like spring barley. Done right, it used to grow serious yields of wholecrop for some people.

 

[Brisel]

We grew both spring barley and spring wheat here last year. I'd rather not grow either on clay soils but we couldn't get the winter cereals all done in 2019 nor autumn 2020 so both will be grown again.

Spring wheat had a gross margin £250/ha higher than barley in 2020. Same 6.5 t/ha yield, but a £45/t price difference.

Wheat vs barley
180 kg/ha N vs 160 kg/ha N (not seeking malting or milling)
W had slightly higher spray costs, mostly PGR and a bit more fungicide. Same herbicides mostly.
W had a higher seed rate as it tillers less Edit: Similar kg/ha seed rate used here, having looked up the records
Both planted at the same time followed by a 3 month drought
The spring wheat matured in mid September and the barley matured 3 weeks earlier.

Thanks to June rains, all the spring wheat got ergot so made feed grade by blending away. Ergot is mostly down to wet weather at ear emergence to flowering and there is little you can do about it, though the old boys swear that applying copper can help.

 

[Al R]

We grew both spring barley and spring wheat here last year. I'd rather not grow either on clay soils but we couldn't get the winter cereals all done in 2019 nor autumn 2020 so both will be grown again.

Spring wheat had a gross margin £250/ha higher than barley in 2020. Same 6.5 t/ha yield, but a £45/t price difference.

Wheat vs barley
180 kg/ha N vs 160 kg/ha N (not seeking malting or milling)
W had slightly higher spray costs, mostly PGR and a bit more fungicide. Same herbicides mostly.
W had a higher seed rate as it tillers less
Both planted at the same time followed by a 3 month drought
The spring wheat matured in mid September and the barley matured 3 weeks earlier.

Thanks to June rains, all the spring wheat got ergot so made feed grade by blending away. Ergot is mostly down to wet weather at ear emergence to flowering and there is little you can do about it, though the old boys swear that applying copper can help.

What seed rate on the wheat? I always found sowing thicker you could pile on the N - 175units and only have to use 1 PGR usually, it would be that thick it wasn’t easy to walk through. It was grown after beet mainly where as barley would just go flat (like a steam roller flat) across the whole field 2-3 weeks pre combining regardless of how much PGR went on, the Wheat would stick it post beet growing, often doing around 4t/acre grain at 80kg/hl and around 2.5t/acre straw!

 

[deleted user 837354]

Ooooof, you poor arable farmers having to put that much N on, here if it got 100 units of N it would be because someone was being generous.

 

[Brisel]

What seed rate on the wheat? I always found sowing thicker you could pile on the N - 175units and only have to use 1 PGR usually, it would be that thick it wasn’t easy to walk through. It was grown after beet mainly where as barley would just go flat (like a steam roller flat) across the whole field 2-3 weeks pre combining regardless of how much PGR went on, the Wheat would stick it post beet growing, often doing around 4t/acre grain at 80kg/hl and around 2.5t/acre straw!

I wasn't here then, but the records actually show roughly the same kg/ha at 210-220 for both, though a few more seeds/m2 on the barley I would imagine if the TGW was lower. Mulika wheat & Laureate barley.

 

[snarling bee]

Ooooof, you poor arable farmers having to put that much N on, here if it got 100 units of N it would be because someone was being generous.

UNITS!?
100 Units is approx 125kg/ha.