Brexit and lamb prices.

[CopperBeech]

Early poll Dorset lambs have only ever been a tiny percentage of UK lamb production, and practically non-existent anywhere but the warm climes of the South West.

Hogget production is hardly a recent trend anyway. There have been sheep folded over roots for centuries, and we were selling all ours as Hoggets in March/April when I got involved with the business in the 80's. I spread my bets a bit more now, and will be selling a lower proportion in March/April than we did 30 years ago.

There is also, always a market for decent lambs, and usually profit if run right. This week got September - November 2020 lambs being drawn to kill, April/May/June 2020 born store hoggs being drawn to kill and two lots of ewes lambing, some dorset and dorset x ewes in one lot inside (arable farm so cheap labour, straw etc) and the other lot are suffolk x / cham x / easy cares / aberfield x and two mules lol outside.

 

[ISCO]

Rees-Mogg the Arch Brexiteer who took his assets to RoI suggests about 50 years - Hey, ho.

It'll not see it then.

If he EU survives it will be up to generations to come to judge Brexit success and , if appropriate, rejoin.

 

[Smith31]

And presumably happy with the good prices being offered then?

They haven't taken a hit, they just haven't made as much as they might if they'd sat on them to put a glut on the market now, even if they had the capacity to sit on them until now.

I know of a few thousand which were sold at lower weights soon adds up

 

[glasshouse]

Sheep sector does not get direct support and hasn't done for a while (support has been land based not sheep based) and when done right doesn't need it
Land based subsidy is shifting to ''green'' value led results that will most likely impinge on the ability to farm productively
Hence all sectors will have to stand on their own two feet --this i think will lead to a move from sheep in the hills/moors etc to greater emphasis on lamb production in lowland /arable integrated systems
What's not to like from an industry point of view?
Clean grazing = good growth & less welfare issues (worms are #1 welfare issue in lamb production)
Grazing animals on arable systems = less artificial N use & potentially less herbicide/pesticide use?

Yes but lowlands arable have no infrastructure and too many busy bodies

 

[No wot]

I'm buggered if I'd want to be basing an entire business around the whims of whatever 'green' policy the government of the day has, and on the whims of an arable farmer, or worse still, those of his consultant/adviser from a shiny suited land agent's office.

Me too , but I'm just saying , don't expect lots of grazing to suddenly appear,especially if there's an agent involved in it

 

[glasshouse]

I'm buggered if I'd want to be basing an entire business around the whims of whatever 'green' policy the government of the day has, and on the whims of an arable farmer, or worse still, those of his consultant/adviser from a shiny suited land agent's office.

Ha
I was asked by the A hole factor to give an undertaking that my sheep would not get into the woods.
I said yes i would if he gave an undertaking that his shoooters and keepers would never leave a gate open

 

[dogandstick]

I still dont get it. My sheep pay all of my bills and i dont get any sub, so I would have been fairly screwed. Its called playing the market, sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. The lamb job was plenty good enough for most of December, they sold for not a bad price, the store job was on fire. The price didn't go down it went up and now those who gambled are reaping the rewards . . . . . this time. Could be different for them next time. You can't blame anyone else.

It’s good that store lamb buyers made money..........they’ll be back for more and pay well for them next time too.

 

[Tim W]

Most sheep farmers are farming in areas where arable isn't possible. So the fact they are going to have to sell their farms to buy expensive arable land to then farm sheep along an arable operation is unrealistic. Or you have arable farmers suddenly having a desire to chase sheep around in the rain in winter instead? It's all well saying from an industry point of view but the industry needs the people in it.

Agree industry needs people to run/work it
But if you think we are the only people who can do that you are wrong
For every shepherd who can't/wont adapt/move there will be others that will rise to the challenge, it's always been that way

Graziers on arable rotations are likely to be share farmers/contract graziers rather than land owners
You don't need to own land to farm ----in fact buying land and expecting to earn a living from farming and a return on investment is probably a poor expectation to have ?

All of which is a long way from brexit and lamb prices

 

[andybk]

There is also, always a market for decent lambs, and usually profit if run right. This week got September - November 2020 lambs being drawn to kill, April/May/June 2020 born store hoggs being drawn to kill and two lots of ewes lambing, some dorset and dorset x ewes in one lot inside (arable farm so cheap labour, straw etc) and the other lot are suffolk x / cham x / easy cares / aberfield x and two mules lol outside.

Lot to be said for dorset or crosses on an arable set up , clean grazing and lambs away before field work starts in anger , no worms / maggots especially if you get feet right ,
I have half dozen pure charollais born out of wedlock in october will be going soon , they cost bugger all to rear on good winter dairy keep , bar grazing headage .,

 

[Tim W]

Yes but lowlands arable have no infrastructure and too many busy bodies

Infrastructure= mobile handling system & electric fencing.
Busy bodies are there to ignore

 

[glasshouse]

Infrastructure= mobile handling system & electric fencing.
Busy bodies are there to ignore

If u want to keep sheep with electric fences u wont do it for long
Especially when every breakout will be a pr disaster with your “ landlord”

 

[Bury the Trash]

If u want to keep sheep with electric fences u wont do it for long
Especially when every breakout will be a pr disaster with your “ landlord”

but modern electric stuff is much better than it was, way more power on 12v , solar, sit on the bike set up....etc

 

[glasshouse]

Infrastructure= mobile handling system & electric fencing.
Busy bodies are there to ignore

Not with camera phones and speed dial rspca

 

[Tim W]

If u want to keep sheep with electric fences u wont do it for long
Especially when every breakout will be a pr disaster with your “ landlord”

Disagree --i and 100's more have operated like this for decades
Just takes a different ''can do'' mindset and a willingness to work with people rather than against them

 

[Tim W]

Not with camera phones and speed dial rspca

If you don't have welfare cases unattended then you're fine

 

[lloyd]

Sheep numbers can quickly be bred up like they
were before foot and mouth and then watch
supply and demand dictate prices.

 

[glasshouse]

If you don't have welfare cases unattended then you're fine

You going to be there all day?

 

[Tim W]

You going to be there all day?

Of course not --- i just speak from experience of running these systems in arable/lowland/high human traffic areas
It's easy enough to do

Don't worry about it ---you run your system & others will do it differently, it's fine

 

[andybk]

Sheep numbers can quickly be bred up like they
were before foot and mouth and then watch
supply and demand dictate prices.

that will happen for sure after this spring , nows the time to sell down anything that causes work or you dont like looking at every day , get a young fit flock for when the inevitable happens .

 

[neilo]

Agree industry needs people to run/work it
But if you think we are the only people who can do that you are wrong
For every shepherd who can't/wont adapt/move there will be others that will rise to the challenge, it's always been that way

Graziers on arable rotations are likely to be share farmers/contract graziers rather than land owners
You don't need to own land to farm ----in fact buying land and expecting to earn a living from farming and a return on investment is probably a poor expectation to have ?

All of which is a long way from brexit and lamb prices

I’d have no qualms about running sheep on arable breaks, and behind electric fencing. However, I would want a base to work from, either owned or with some security of tenure, otherwise one wet winter, or a landlord changing his mind, could lead you into a position where your grazing disappears overnight.

Haven’t you been in a similar position, where you’ve had to reduce ewe numbers at short notice because of someone else’s decisions? That’s got to be hard enough with a flying flock of mules, but must be heartbreaking if it’s a flock that you’ve been spending time & money improving.
I know when we use to take lots of grass keep round home, we regularly used to lose blocks at short notice, usually to a friend of the landlord’s agent, who would take it & trash it for a year, before they came back and offered it to us again. I was certainly glad of the stability offered by getting off that hamster wheel.